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Star Wars: The Clone Wars - Season 5 Discussion


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#26 Fives

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Posted 21 March 2012 - 01:06 AM

I just read that interview, and it was interesting to hear how Filoni felt about Maul. I love the fact that they are giving him more depth, and making him a true villain, rather than just an object of destruction. Maul is a character now, unlike how he was in TPM. Also, the mention of a story that gets into the details of Maul's character is very exciting. I hope they do a four part arc, and really get deep into who Maul is, what his relationship with Palpatine was like (and how his return will affect Palpatine), and if he views Oppress as an equal, or will use him as an instrument, much like he was used by Sidious.

Edited by Fives, 21 March 2012 - 01:08 AM.

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#27 Brickadeer

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 02:00 PM

A pretty long (5 pages) Dave Filoni "Looking back at season 4" interview of March 21 (with a few implications for season 5):

http://tv.ign.com/ar.../1221285p1.html

IGN TV said:

Clone Wars' supervising director, Dave Filoni, goes into detail about Darth Maul, Boba Fett, Asajj Ventress and more - and hints at what's to come in Season 5.

Dave Filoni said:

But no more pixie dust stuff for Artoo.
:thumbup:

Edited by Brickadeer, 22 March 2012 - 02:20 PM.


#28 Brickdoctor

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 06:09 PM

That was actually a pretty good read. Filoni seems to be handling all the problems we've pointed out pretty well, I think. I guess I always knew in the back of my mind that a lot of the stuff I picked on was Lucas' doing, but it's good to hear it from Filoni himself. Gives me hope for the series. And like I said in the last review of S4 for the blog, I think S4 did a lot of character development and setup work, so, hopefully, S5 can come back and build on that.

Respect for Filoni, +1
Respect for Lucas, -1

I find it hilarious, by the way, that I mentioned in the S4 topic that the Maul-Savage battle reminded me of LotR, and in this interview, Filoni compares snake-weirdo to Gollum and Maul to Shelob.

#29 Brickadeer

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 06:56 PM

I agree it was a pretty good read. I like his way to explore possibilities and his sense for diversity. His view of the droids makes me looking at the respective season 4 episodes much more milder.

New information is always evaluated on grounds of previous knowledge. Since LoTR was a pretty huge success, references experienced as similarities are to be expected  :classic:

#30 Brickdoctor

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 07:05 PM

View PostBrickadeer, on 22 March 2012 - 06:56 PM, said:

I agree it was a pretty good read. I like his way to explore possibilities and his sense for diversity. His view of the droids makes me looking at the respective season 4 episodes much more milder.
Indeed. Somehow, knowing that Filoni wasn't a huge fan of all the magic makes me - and I rarely say this - look forward to the next season of CW.

Of course, if Lucas keeps doing what he's doing, that might all mean nothing...

#31 Brickadeer

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Posted 22 March 2012 - 07:22 PM

View PostBrickdoctor, on 22 March 2012 - 07:05 PM, said:

Indeed. Somehow, knowing that Filoni wasn't a huge fan of all the magic makes me - and I rarely say this - look forward to the next season of CW.

Of course, if Lucas keeps doing what he's doing, that might all mean nothing...
I think Lucas will further explore the concept of the force (I think that's one of your major concerns).

I find the concept of the force still contradictive:

On the one hand, Yoda explains the force as something that needs to be trusted (like it was the case in "Revenge"). On the other hand, we are told that the force has a dark side that consumes its users, so it appears to be something that clearly can not be trusted.

That contradiction makes in no way clear what the force is, or what it wants, or why it should be trusted, or when it can't be trusted.

I think Lucas will further explore the concept of the force. I don't have the slightest idea though how Mortis relates to these questions, what Lucas might have in mind, and what we will see in the future.

Edited by Brickadeer, 22 March 2012 - 07:24 PM.


#32 Fives

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 02:23 PM

I read the interview yesterday, and I found it interesting to get Filoni's thoughts on the whole season. I'm glad that he wasn't really 100% on board with the episodes about 3P0 and R2, and he did give some good hints to next season. But, I think, out of the whole interview, the one thing that caught my attention the most was his concept on how Maul survived for over ten years after his "death". He referenced the idea of how the Jedi can become one with the Force, and after death, become spirits. He then went on to say that the Soth are capable of this, but it all happens in the physical world. So, pretty much Maul harnessed the abilities to survive after death at the same time Qui-Gon did, but rather than becoming a spirit, he became this wretched thing living a horrible existence. It just goes to show how similar the Jedi and the Sith are, but since the both learn only one side of the Force, they are taken to different places under similar circumstances. Interesting stuff...
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#33 Brickadeer

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 03:25 PM

View PostFives, on 23 March 2012 - 02:23 PM, said:

I read the interview yesterday, and I found it interesting to get Filoni's thoughts on the whole season. I'm glad that he wasn't really 100% on board with the episodes about 3P0 and R2, and he did give some good hints to next season. But, I think, out of the whole interview, the one thing that caught my attention the most was his concept on how Maul survived for over ten years after his "death". He referenced the idea of how the Jedi can become one with the Force, and after death, become spirits. He then went on to say that the Soth are capable of this, but it all happens in the physical world. So, pretty much Maul harnessed the abilities to survive after death at the same time Qui-Gon did, but rather than becoming a spirit, he became this wretched thing living a horrible existence. It just goes to show how similar the Jedi and the Sith are, but since the both learn only one side of the Force, they are taken to different places under similar circumstances. Interesting stuff...
That's an intersting point, it totally slipped past my attention  :sceptic:

Thanks for pointing it out  :thumbup: , I have to re-read this interview.

#34 Sir_Basil_Ashton

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 01:05 AM

I finally got to read the interview and there was a lot of good stuff in there. I really wish I could got to SDCC or Celebration VI this year and join in the festivities. I hope Season 5 continues on what Season 4 closed on. I'm looking forward to some great stories being told.

#35 LEGOman273

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 05:03 PM

One thing that I wonder if will be covered in the coming seasons is that of how Padmé became pregnant.
One would think that in a society as advanced as this is; they would have good birth control. Perhaps an off-hand comment about their desire for children could be used. :sceptic:

#36 General Magma

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 05:05 PM

View PostLEGOman273, on 26 March 2012 - 05:03 PM, said:

One thing that I wonder if will be covered in the coming seasons is that of how Padmé became pregnant.

I don't think I want to see that in a show that airs on CN... *huh* :tongue:

Edited by General Magma, 26 March 2012 - 05:45 PM.


#37 Mr Man

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 05:07 PM

View PostLEGOman273, on 26 March 2012 - 05:03 PM, said:

One thing that I wonder if will be covered in the coming seasons is that of how Padmé became pregnant.
One would think that in a society as advanced as this is; they would have good birth control. Perhaps an off-hand comment about their desire for children could be used. :sceptic:

Something that leads up to the CW episode. (so far nothing of TCW has replaced or overridden the original CW.
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#38 LEGOman273

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 05:11 PM

View PostGeneral Magma, on 26 March 2012 - 05:05 PM, said:

I don't think I want to see that in a show that airs on CN... *huh*
That is why I said that they could use an off-hand comment about the desire for children.

View PostMr Man, on 26 March 2012 - 05:07 PM, said:

Something that leads up to the CW episode. (so far nothing of TCW has replaced or overridden the original CW.
What CW episode is that? (I have a hard time watching CW; I really dislike the animation style. TCW-style is better IMO)
Ventress's story?

#39 Mr Man

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 05:19 PM

View PostLEGOman273, on 26 March 2012 - 05:11 PM, said:

What CW episode is that? (I have a hard time watching CW; I really dislike the animation style. TCW-style is better IMO)
Ventress's story?

I can't remember off hand, one of the later chapters I think. I agree about it been harder to watch, but for me the problem with it is the same as the Droids series, the cheesy dialog, it can be cringe worthy at times. Also some of the voice acting is really off par (except Obi Wan who has the same voice actor in both CW and TCW).
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#40 LEGOman273

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 07:21 PM

View PostMr Man, on 26 March 2012 - 05:19 PM, said:

I can't remember off hand, one of the later chapters I think. I agree about it been harder to watch, but for me the problem with it is the same as the Droids series, the cheesy dialog, it can be cringe worthy at times. Also some of the voice acting is really off par (except Obi Wan who has the same voice actor in both CW and TCW).
I agree about the voice acting and diologue. At some points it seemed detached from the action. Emotionless when emotion should be shown.
The animation is stiff, choppy, and often exagerated and unnatural. The effects are not good either; explosions lack the depth of color seen in TCW (See "A Friend in Need" and the Umbara arc to see what I mean), and they lack the shockwaves seen in TCW. Characters in CW often do not move when they are in action (standing still while talking v.s. moving naturally in TCW).
All in all, CW lacks the depth, detail, and realism that TCW has.

#41 Clone OPatra

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 08:06 PM

View PostLEGOman273, on 26 March 2012 - 07:21 PM, said:

All in all, CW lacks the depth, detail, and realism that TCW has.
CW is stylized 2D animation.  You may like the 3D cg animation in TCW better, but you just can't compare the two on any basis other than your personal preference.  I find the stylized 2D more fun, but I wouldn't say it's better.  It's just different and I prefer it.
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#42 AND3RSEN

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 10:20 PM

I hope that they address the darker side of the war in season 5. To me, season 4 made the clone wars seem like a fun adventure for all the jedi and droids. I would like to see a story arc dealing with clone troopers who feel used, and begin to despise the republic. I just want it to be about the war, no crazy story arcs about droids, dark jedi in hiding, and bounty hunters working in the fringe. I think I may be expecting too much as this is intended as a kids show, but it is a war after all. As long as its starwars though, I can manage.

#43 LEGOman273

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 10:25 PM

View PostAND3RSEN, on 26 March 2012 - 10:20 PM, said:

I hope that they address the darker side of the war in season 5. To me, season 4 made the clone wars seem like a fun adventure for all the jedi and droids. I would like to see a story arc dealing with clone troopers who feel used, and begin to despise the republic. I just want it to be about the war, no crazy story arcs about droids, dark jedi in hiding, and bounty hunters working in the fringe. I think I may be expecting too much as this is intended as a kids show, but it is a war after all. As long as its starwars though, I can manage.
We saw the darker side of the war in the Umbara arc.

#44 Brickdoctor

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 10:26 PM

View PostAND3RSEN, on 26 March 2012 - 10:20 PM, said:

I hope that they address the darker side of the war in season 5. To me, season 4 made the clone wars seem like a fun adventure for all the jedi and droids. I would like to see a story arc dealing with clone troopers who feel used, and begin to despise the republic. I just want it to be about the war, no crazy story arcs about droids, dark jedi in hiding, and bounty hunters working in the fringe. I think I may be expecting too much as this is intended as a kids show, but it is a war after all. As long as its starwars though, I can manage.
Agreed. I think S4 was a lot of character development, brought on by all the new supporting characters and main characters who have barely changed over the preceding three seasons, so you have a lot of mixed up darker storylines, lighter storylines, insane storylines, and everything in-between in order to get all the characters back on track for their alignment in Sith.

#45 Brickadeer

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 11:21 PM

View PostAND3RSEN, on 26 March 2012 - 10:20 PM, said:

I think I may be expecting too much as this is intended as a kids show, but it is a war after all. As long as its starwars though, I can manage.
I do not think that you are expecting too much because it is a kid's show. I think that you are expecting something different because the show is called "The Clone Wars". The point is that the title is a name for a historic phase that was given its name by an event that dominated the era and therefore all subsequent events.

I cannot blame you for having the preferences you have, and for holding the expectations that come with them.

I only can suggest to think of the following:

- The Clone Wars take place in a bigger context, Sidious' rise to power and the destruction of the Jedi Order. The war is important, but it's just a means to an end. As Maul's remark indicated, it was long planned.
- Skywalker plays a major role in Sidious' plans, and consequently so do all events shaping Skywalker and the factors that influence his future decisions.
- The Droid episodes, as Filoni reminded us, or at least me, were not directly related to these events. However, they showed different aspects of the Star Wars universe, aspects that may get lost, so to say, as casulties of the Clone Wars.
- After all, it's George Lucas who is behind the major decisions of the storyline. Of course we might say that he is an idiot because we don't like what we see or what he's trying to tell us. However, this line of reasoning doesn't improve our insights in why he does what he does. And personally, that's the question I found much more interesting to deal with.

#46 Sir_Basil_Ashton

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 01:54 AM

View PostClone O, on 26 March 2012 - 08:06 PM, said:

CW is stylized 2D animation.  You may like the 3D cg animation in TCW better, but you just can't compare the two on any basis other than your personal preference.  I find the stylized 2D more fun, but I wouldn't say it's better.  It's just different and I prefer it.
For me, I like both CW and TCW for what they are. For the time I can say I like TCW because it continues to tell me Star Wars stories. I agree that the animation styles are completely different. CW and TCW were made 5 years apart and in that time many advances were made in technology. It's just not fair to compare them.

#47 The Legonater

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 02:48 AM

Reading this article just reinforces my opinion on Filoni- he's actually doing a great job, and it's Lucas who's the problem.


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#48 382nd Legionnaire

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 03:21 AM

I think the more the CW series progresses, the more the series shifts away from the actual Clone Wars. I remember when the CW movie was to be released, the developers said they wanted to focus more on the battles between the 2nd and 3rd movie. They wanted to showcase the large clone and droid armies on the battlefield. It was alright at first and we did get some decent battles for the CW series but I feel its on a decline with the introduction of Darth Maul. That's always been a problem for George Lucas. Battle scenes with large forces fighting one another have always been short clips. I feel like Star Wars is more about the rise and fall of Anakin Skywalker more than Star Wars as a universe. For goodness sake, war is half the name. George Lucas should take a series with battles done right: Lord of the Rings. Sorry for the rant.

#49 The Legonater

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 05:21 AM

View Post382nd Legionnaire, on 27 March 2012 - 03:21 AM, said:

I think the more the CW series progresses, the more the series shifts away from the actual Clone Wars. I remember when the CW movie was to be released, the developers said they wanted to focus more on the battles between the 2nd and 3rd movie. They wanted to showcase the large clone and droid armies on the battlefield. It was alright at first and we did get some decent battles for the CW series but I feel its on a decline with the introduction of Darth Maul. That's always been a problem for George Lucas. Battle scenes with large forces fighting one another have always been short clips. I feel like Star Wars is more about the rise and fall of Anakin Skywalker more than Star Wars as a universe. For goodness sake, war is half the name. George Lucas should take a series with battles done right: Lord of the Rings. Sorry for the rant.


Frankly, the original six movies are about the rie and fall of Anakin Skywalker. As for The Clone Wars, though, I agree. More and more they've slipped away from the battle, and into more trivial things, like bounty hunters and politics. Don;t get me wrong- I like bounty hunters- but it seems to be a larger foucs than the wars. I remember the first day I really recognised the meaning behind the name 'Star Wars' - I think I was about four- and I kind of stopped to think 'Y'know, there actally aren't a whole lot of star wars'. That note has echoed on into The Clone Wars, not- they don't really focus a lot on the clones, nevermind the Clone Wars.

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#50 Brickadeer

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 10:36 AM

View PostThe Legonater, on 27 March 2012 - 05:21 AM, said:

Frankly, the original six movies are about the rie and fall of Anakin Skywalker. As for The Clone Wars, though, I agree. More and more they've slipped away from the battle, and into more trivial things, like bounty hunters and politics. Don;t get me wrong- I like bounty hunters- but it seems to be a larger foucs than the wars. I remember the first day I really recognised the meaning behind the name 'Star Wars' - I think I was about four- and I kind of stopped to think 'Y'know, there actally aren't a whole lot of star wars'. That note has echoed on into The Clone Wars, not- they don't really focus a lot on the clones, nevermind the Clone Wars.
"Star Wars", like "The Clone Wars", is about a historic era. It doesn't mean that everywhere is war action. In World War II, hardly, if any, war actions took place on the North American Continent. Rather, it was about plots against Americans, or imagined plots against Americans. The war affected America in a different way like it affected Japan or Europe. Nevertheless, America was affected by the war. E. g. Executive Order 9066 (yes, I think it is a reference) and the detention of Japanese Americans would not have taken place if there would have been no war. The Republic is affected in a similar way by the war, its internal, its political structure changes and rises serious questions about political identities, justice, and sourvereignity: who decides who we are? Are we in control of the situation? Do we understand how our lifes are affected by the decisions we make, and are we still in control of the consequences of our decisions? These changes are reflected by what you call "the more trivial thing: politics". I would not call "politics" trivial, though. Rather, it is and reflects an integral part of the war.

I mean the ironic thing about the Seperatists is that they are morally right: do you remember how Count Dooku justified the Seperatist movement? He said that the Senate was controlled by a Sith Lord, and actually, at least to some degree, he said the truth. So if you start thinking about the legitimacy of the Republic going to war with the Seperatists, you have to realize that there is non. The Seperatist were right to leave the Republic. Unfortunately, they did not realize that their leader is a Sith Lord as well. Apparently, Sidious is so to say a master in using uncertainty for his own advantage. Even Yoda is tricked when he believes that Dooku is trying to create uncertainty and distrust; he doesn't even consider the possibility that Dooku says the truth. It really, really is a brilliant game.

The political episodes are the tragic ones: fundamental questions are risen, but in the end reason doesn't prevail. Rather, the Senate's decisions are dictated by necessity. He behaves like an orchestra, and Sidious is the conductor, letting the Senate play pretty much every melody that he wants to hear.

Edited by Brickadeer, 27 March 2012 - 11:05 AM.




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