Heroica RPG General Discussion

[Sandy]

Would it be allowed to have a character person sentient being be considered a "Quest Item"? As opposed to an NPC? (If you need more context, I'd be happy to share privately.) I can't think of any mechanical reason it'd be a problem, the only problem I see is that it would sort of de-humanize them.

Are you seriously asking this? Let me get this right: you're afraid of de-humanizing minifigs?!

[Darth Nihilus]

Still, Shields are supposed to be the best rolls, Stunning yourself for no reason isn't that beneficial to anyone. But it is just one enemy type, so as long as Black Knights don't get into any Wren Quests, it shouldn't pose much trouble.

I accept your challenge! Next Wren quest, if Dak's Level 15 by then, I'm signing up!

BTW, TheBoyWonder, I'm a bit flattered by your character's similarities to Dak, but a little offended as well. It seems like it's a combination of Dak (black hair, twin swords, the same torso he had a few months ago) and The Legonater's character (name..sort of).

[Tanma]

OK, this has been rattling around the back of my head for a while, so I'll just outright ask it:

Would it be allowed to have a character person sentient being be considered a "Quest Item"? As opposed to an NPC? (If you need more context, I'd be happy to share privately.) I can't think of any mechanical reason it'd be a problem, the only problem I see is that it would sort of de-humanize them.

I know what you mean, perhaps you could go the Quest 12 route and give them personality. Or go the Quest 26 route and have them give benefits to the party.

Here's a similar idea, could you have sentient beings as weapons, such as a Golem or an Automaton? They could be like the empathic swords some players have (Freud might have something to say about that) but able to move on their own and fight on their own. They would function the same as normal weapons rather than a summon, and damage dealt to them would hurt their controllers, maybe through an empathy link. Any thoughts on this?

Edited May 2, 2012 by Tanma

[CMP]

BTW, TheBoyWonder, I'm a bit flattered by your character's similarities to Dak, but a little offended as well. It seems like it's a combination of Dak (black hair, twin swords, the same torso he had a few months ago) and The Legonater's character (name..sort of).

It's just the usual Rogue archtype. Most Rogues have blaring similarities to eachother, just look at all the inactive players' pictures in the Hall. Black/brown robes and cloaks and outfits and twin daggers/swords pretty much come with the class. Unfortunate, but pretty much true.

Edited May 2, 2012 by CallMePieOrDie

[JimBee]

I'm definitely excited for these new job classes, though I'm glad it will take a while to get there. Wouldn't want to burn this game out too quick.

Still, Shields are supposed to be the best rolls, Stunning yourself for no reason isn't that beneficial to anyone. But it is just one enemy type, so as long as Black Knights don't get into any Wren Quests, it shouldn't pose much trouble.

I think having Shield rolls having the possibility of being negative is a necessary evil. The best examples I can think of right now are the Knight's shield roll and the Mage's Magic Burst. For the former, while the Knight is powerful they only have a 2 in 6 (1 in 3) chance of dealing damage. While this protects the party, it may slow the battle. And for magic bursts, the Mage cannot choose their gem, so there is a chance that they won't deal any damage at all.

IMO they're great balancing factors to classes that might seem overpowered.

[CMP]

IMO they're great balancing factors to classes that might seem overpowered.

Fair point. All things considered, Black Knight is a really interesting class even without the Shield.

[Darth Nihilus]

It's just the usual Rogue archtype. Most Rogues have blaring similarities to eachother, just look at all the inactive players' pictures in the Hall. Black/brown robes and cloaks and outfits and twin daggers/swords pretty much come with the class. Unfortunate, but pretty much true.

I'm a little bit less worried about that than the torso/name similarities to Dak and Dyric. When my character was named Eric to start with, Sandy asked me in PM to change the name, since there already was an Eric. So, I did. I don't think the rules about names have changed since then... Also, the torso made the exact same way I did it, albeit with yellow arms rather than flesh, is a bit disturbing to me as well.

[Flipz]

I'm definitely excited for these new job classes, though I'm glad it will take a while to get there. Wouldn't want to burn this game out too quick.

I think having Shield rolls having the possibility of being negative is a necessary evil. The best examples I can think of right now are the Knight's shield roll and the Mage's Magic Burst. For the former, while the Knight is powerful they only have a 2 in 6 (1 in 3) chance of dealing damage. While this protects the party, it may slow the battle. And for magic bursts, the Mage cannot choose their gem, so there is a chance that they won't deal any damage at all.

IMO they're great balancing factors to classes that might seem overpowered.

Agreed. Clerics have the same situation, especially if they're first in the battle order for a full health party and then the party rolls a bunch of Damage rolls. Clerics and Knights both have a 2/6 attack ratio, compared to the physically weak but VERY dangerous Ranger. Rangers are the only basic class with a 4/6 attack ratio, and all of their Advanced Classes keep Aim as well, allowing them to be a constant source of damage against the enemy.

[CMP]

I suppose it is fair now that I think about it. Humanoids are, hands down, the most common enemy type. And with an extra multiplier to WP, you could do serious damage. If only there was a Black Knight in Quest 17....

[Darkdragon]

... Clerics have the same situation, especially if they're first in the battle order for a full health party ...

It would take quite an incompetent party leader to do this.

[Quarryman]

The tentative job classes tied with the main houses of power are:

Minstrel (The Hinckwells)

Dragoon (The Shadeaux)

Necromancer (The Ziegfrieds)

Cannoneer (The Bonapartes)

Alchemist (The Guild of Invision)

Chi Monk (The Ji Pei)

Beast Warrior (The Wolfgang)

Ah.. too bad you decided to drop all the others you had lined up, some of them were quite interesting. (Or will they return in some other form perhaps?) Still, as long as I can be a Necromancer I'm pretty satisfied.

I think having Shield rolls having the possibility of being negative is a necessary evil. The best examples I can think of right now are the Knight's shield roll and the Mage's Magic Burst. For the former, while the Knight is powerful they only have a 2 in 6 (1 in 3) chance of dealing damage. While this protects the party, it may slow the battle. And for magic bursts, the Mage cannot choose their gem, so there is a chance that they won't deal any damage at all.

Another interesting aspect of the Magic Burst is that it's one of few abilities (probably the only one, can't think of any others at the moment at least) that actually gets worse as you make progress, since its chances of using a fitting element decreases as you get more gems.

[LEGOman273]

I like Black Knight, it it is limited by the lack of an ability to mug, whereas the rest of the rogue classes can. Mystic Knight lacks the ether to sustain a powerful magic attack. Warden's Aura can get you Ko'd quite easily.

I'd say go with Assassin, but then again, I am Pete[/i] like 1. To carry no-need-to-retrieve ranged weapons, 2. To have a 1/6 chance of an instant kill, 3. MOAR GOLD!!!!, 4. Being a Badass.

*Snip*

I like it, but I really don't want to give up the extra Gold and 1/6 chance of an instant kill that I would have as an Assassin. Could you possibly incorporate this?

@All:

Is there any way that one can be a part of one of these advanced classes, without swearing allegiance to one faction?

Daxus works for himself, and would never serve only one faction.

[Bricksandparts]

@All:

Is there any way that one can be a part of one of these advanced classes, without swearing allegiance to one faction?

Daxus works for himself, and would never serve only one faction.

You can choose between 4 expert classes (If you have enough good reputations) other than other faction expert classes.

[Sandy]

Ah.. too bad you decided to drop all the others you had lined up, some of them were quite interesting. (Or will they return in some other form perhaps?) Still, as long as I can be a Necromancer I'm pretty satisfied.

Well, balancing the seven is quite a hassle already, and I wanted to leave room for the classes pitched by the other QMs. For reference, the other classes I toyed in my head were:

Gladiator

Crusader

Jester

Illusionist

Gambler

Heretic

Exorcist

Privateer

Weather Prophet

Falconer

Mandrake

Tao Master

Ninja

Tamer

Feel free to use any of these titles if you are designing your own expert job classes. But remember that I only accept pitches from people who have hosted quests.

Is there any way that one can be a part of one of these advanced classes, without swearing allegiance to one faction?

Daxus works for himself, and would never serve only one faction.

Umm, the whole point of the expert classes is to reward loyalty to a certain faction. You can always just stick with the advanced job classes until you reach Level 50, if you want to remain neutral.

[LEGOman273]

You can choose between 4 expert classes (If you have enough good reputations) other than other faction expert classes.

Good.

@Theboywonder:

Could Leo come back to the Hall, and sell me his items before he leaves?

@Sandy: Is this allowable? I think it would be, as it would be a transaction, not simply dumping items.

Umm, the whole point of the expert classes is to reward loyalty to a certain faction. You can always just stick with the advanced job classes until you reach Level 50, if you want to remain neutral.

Perhaps a neutral class could be created that one could join if they have good reputations with half of the major factions.

The name could be Mercenary.

[Scubacarrot]

I have a Question: If you have say an Advanced class as a quest reward, is it basically "unlocked", meaning you can switch to it at any time, or do you have to switch to it at that instant? Also, if your Reputation would go down with a faction after you already unlocked a class, could you still switch back to the unlocked class?

[Sandy]

I have a Question: If you have say an Advanced class as a quest reward, is it basically "unlocked", meaning you can switch to it at any time, or do you have to switch to it at that instant? Also, if your Reputation would go down with a faction after you already unlocked a class, could you still switch back to the unlocked class?

The mechanics of the expert job classes will be explained in more details later, but you can play the affiliated class only as long as you keep up the good reputation with the faction (it doesn't matter if it drops from "great" to "good" just as long as the player is in good terms with the faction).

@Theboywonder:

Could Leo come back to the Hall, and sell me his items before he leaves?

@Sandy: Is this allowable? I think it would be, as it would be a transaction, not simply dumping items.

Perhaps a neutral class could be created that one could join if they have good reputations with half of the major factions.

The name could be Mercenary.

What would prevent BoyWonder from selling his old items for only a nominal price, like 1 gold? I say no, the character has been dropped out so his stuff is gone with him. Earn your own loot, dammit.

Isn't everyone in Heroica some sort of mercenaries already? I just don't see the point of adding another neutral class, since you can still play as an advanced class even after you reach Level 30.

[Jedi master Brick]

OOC: Will this be retconned for those who completed Quest 17 as well?

How do you think Brickdoctor is, Geroge Lucas?

[Bricksandparts]

Earn your own loot, dammit.

http://www.darthsanddroids.net/episodes/0039.html

[Flipz]

Isn't everyone in Heroica some sort of mercenaries already? I just don't see the point of adding another neutral class, since you can still play as an advanced class even after you reach Level 30.

On that note, I assume that if someone wanted to, they could keep their base class until they reached Level 30 and then switch directly to an Expert class, or could keep a base class up to Level 50 before taking a Master Class?

Also, is it possible to switch between unlocked Expert Classes in the way one can switch between Advanced Classes, or can you only go back to your Advanced Class or up to Master Class? And are there levels of reputation higher than just "great"?

How do you think Brickdoctor is, Geroge Lucas?

Shaddap. I like Lion Knights.

EDIT: Although they may not like me after that incident...on that note, Sandy, can heroes voluntarily refuse Reputation increases, aside from just avoiding Quests that award reputation from a given faction?

Edited May 2, 2012 by Flipz

[Sandy]

On that note, I assume that if someone wanted to, they could keep their base class until they reached Level 30 and then switch directly to an Expert class, or could keep a base class up to Level 50 before taking a Master Class?

Of course you can stick with your basic class. Nobody's going to twist your arm and force you to change.

Also, is it possible to switch between unlocked Expert Classes in the way one can switch between Advanced Classes, or can you only go back to your Advanced Class or up to Master Class? And are there levels of reputation higher than just "great"?

Expert classes can be switched as long as you have a "great" reputation with the other faction as well (or whatever conditions the other QMs require for their classes).

The levels of reputation are "good" (after completing one quest for the faction successfully), "great" (after two quests) and "outstanding" (after three quests). These will have storyline purposes later on, if we ever get to that point with the main story. There's still loads of quests for me to host before that...

[Scubacarrot]

Although they may not like me after that incident...on that note, Sandy, can heroes voluntarily refuse Reputation increases, aside from just avoiding Quests that award reputation from a given faction?

"Yeah, I totally killed those Shadeaux soldiers, but no, I don't want you to like me, the Shadeaux will think worse of me!"

I'm going out on a limb and say.... probably not, as you said, you can easily avoid Quests if you want reputation with a certain faction, I think.

[Sandy]

on that note, Sandy, can heroes voluntarily refuse Reputation increases, aside from just avoiding Quests that award reputation from a given faction?

Not without failing the quest. You can't really refuse something as abstract as reputation.

"No, Mr. Hinckwell, I don't want you to keep me in high regard. The Shadeaux won't like me otherwise."

EDIT: Dammit, Scubacarrot, you stole my joke!

[Flipz]

The levels of reputation are "good" (after completing one quest for the faction successfully), "great" (after two quests) and "outstanding" (after three quests). These will have storyline purposes later on, if we ever get to that point with the main story. There's still loads of quests for me to host before that...

There's a storyline?! Sorry, joke had to be made.

[Scubacarrot]

Not without failing the quest. You can't really refuse something as abstract as reputation.

"No, Mr. Hinckwell, I don't want you to keep me in high regard. The Shadeaux won't like me otherwise."

You totally stole my joke.