Mafia School: A Bedtime Story - Day Two

[Flipz]

I have not had contact with the Cop yet. I urge you to come forward, any and all information will be most helpful!

[Dakar A]

Alright guys, I've come up with a few scenarios of what could happen in the next night phase:

1.Doctor protects cop

Mafia blocks doctor

Town blocks Mafia Role cop

Cop investigates Mafia

Result:1 mafia down

2.Doctor protects cop

Mafia blocks doctor

Town blocks random palyer

Cop investigates town

Rsult: Nothing

3. Doctor protects cop

Town blocks cop

Role cop finds cop

Mafia blocks doctor

Result: Cop is know by mafia, becomes next target. Mafia knows all PR except blocker

4.Cop catches Role cop

Doctor protects cop

Mafia blocks Doctor

Mafia kill doctor

Result 1 mafia/1 town PR out

5.Mafia kills doctor

Cop investigates townie

Town blocker blocks role cop

Result: Doctor down

6.Cop investigates mafia

Doctor protects blocker/ cop

Rolecop finds nothing

Mafia blocker blocks Vanila

Result: 50% chance of removing Mafia PR, town is safe Best possibl town result.

These were based on the idea that Wolf and Pinnochio had no power roles, and that the mafia knew the identity of the doctor. Anyone have other possible scenarios?

These show how important it is that the Town power roles become known to each other.

[Flipz]

*sniff sniffle* I think I just felt Mr. Bear's spirit watching over us! Let's make him proud, everyone!

Puss, those are great analyses of various possibilities, but in fairness, we should prepare ourselves in case Mara Jade truly is the Town blocker and is not lying to us. I don't think this is the case, but after losing Pinocchio I do not want to make any decisions about lynching lightly. So, let's take a look at some of the possibilities if we believe Mara Jade:

1.

Doctor protects Blocker

Blocker blocks Cop

Scum Blocker blocks Doctor

Scum Role Cop investigates Cop

Scum kills Blocker.

2.

Doctor protects Cop

Blocker blocks Cop

Scum Blocker blocks Doctor

Scum Role Cop investigates Blocker

Scum kills Cop.

3. Doctor protects Blocker.

Blocker blocks Cop

Scum Blocker blocks Doctor

Scum Role Cop investigates Cop

Scum kills Doctor.

This would represent a second breakdown among the Trusted. If the second or third scenario happens, there is no way in hell Mara Jade would go unlynched on Day 3, as she would be revealed by surviving trusted Good Guys, but at the same time we would lose our Doctor or our Cop on one night and the other would die the next. (In Scenario 1 Mara Jade would be telling the truth but would die for it.) But these are worst-case scenarios, and ones that assume that people targetting the Cop randomly get it right, let's look at some more likely ones, based on who knows what currently (but still assuming that Mara Jade is telling the truth):

4. Doctor protects Blocker

Blocker blocks vanilla

Scum Blocker blocks ??? (not the Cop)

Scum Role Cop investigates ??? (not the Cop or the Blocker)

Cop investigates ???

Scum kills Doctor

This is our most likely scenario for the night. Well, aside from one I'll point out below.

5. Doctor protects Blocker

Blocker blocks Scum killer

Cop investigates ???

Scum Blocker blocks Doctor

Scum Role Cop investigates ??? (this would be the only action that would change the outcome of the Night from good to bad or vice versa)

Scum attempts to kill Blocker

I have no clue what would happen here, even after contacting God for clarification about how the PRs would work. (For added "fun," have the Cop and the Scum Role Cop investigate each other. ) I suspect that something would happen, and God would be very angry with all of the Power Roles for giving her such a headache. So Scum, don't do this!

6. Doctor protects Blocker (yes, this is a theme--unless the Cop reveals themself, if Mara Jade is telling the truth James Bond will protect her. If she's lying, of course, that won't happen, but remember, right now we're assuming Mara Jade is being truthful.)

Blocker blocks Scum killer.

Cop investigates ???

Scum Blocker blocks Doctor (because, if Mara Jade is telling the truth in private, the scum don't know for sure who Mara Jade is)

Scum Role Cop investigates ??? (again, not a factor in this)

Scum fails to kill.

This would be the ideal situation for the Good Guys, assuming that the Scum Role Cop does not catch a Power Role and depending on whether or not the Cop catches a Scum. Sadly, there's less than a 1/4 chance of the Blocker picking a Scum, and even then there's an additional 3/4 chance they'll pick the wrong Scum, so there's not much chance this'll happen.

7.

Doctor protects Blocker

Blocker blocks ??? (not the Scum killer)

Cop investigates ???

Scum Blocker blocks Doctor

Scum Role Cop investigates ???

Scum kills Doctor.

The Scum sure shot, and if Mara Jade is trusted, she wouldn't be after this. However, it gives the Cop a free night of investigation, and will clarify a number of peoples' alignments based on earlier discussions.

8. Here's the second most likely course of action for tonight, assuming we decide to trust Mara Jade:

Doctor protects Blocker

Blocker blocks vanilla

Cop investigates ???

Scum Blocker blocks ???

Scum Role Cop investigates ???

Scum kills me.

This would be a devastating blow, but isn't exactly wise. Why? Well, for one thing, everyone would know beyond a shadow of a doubt that I'm a Good Guy, and therefore all my information (which I will pass out before the Night ends) will be publicly revealed and can be completely trusted. It may not be correct, but you will know that I'm working from a Good Guy perspective, which would help the Good Guys' analysis.

OK, now, going back to the current (justified) belief that Mara Jade is Scum, here's what will probably happen tonight:

9.

Doctor protects me

Blocker blocks ???

Cop investigates ???

Scum Blocker blocks Doctor

Scum Role Cop investigates ???

Scum kills me

Again same disadvantages as #8, but this time we wouldn't know who our blocker is.

There's other scenarios as well, but I'm getting a bit woozy from all this typing. I'll be around if anyone wants to chat.

[Sandy]

The residents of the Fairy Tale Castle enjoyed a delicious lunch consisting of bear stew and wolf ribs. It gave them strength and courage to start another arduous afternoon of voting. As they approached the ballroom and the Looking-Glass they pondered if they would get it right this time?.

But their thoughts were interrupted by a disturbing sight.

"Oh, you're warming up to me again, charmymarmy!" Cinderella exclaimed as she squeezed Prince Charming against her. The prince mouthed a soundless "help!" to the others.

It is now time to vote again. You have a maximum of 48 hours to reach a conviction, which takes 7 votes against one player.

Current Vote Tally:

Red Riding Hood/Lord of the Fries: 5 (penalty for not posting in Day One)

[Dakar A]

Hmm.. Hood hasn't appeared yet today either. A lynch against her, or a possible scum (Not to say that she can't be scum, though...). Thoughts?

[Alex the Great]

I'm not too sure who to vote on, but does no one else have any info from last night to reveal? I don't find Mara Jade's defense very good at all, if that is what truly has been happening.

Maybe voting Red isn't really a bad thing, even if she is a good guy; she's a very useless one.

[JackJonespaw]

I'm not too sure who to vote on, but does no one else have any info from last night to reveal? I don't find Mara Jade's defense very good at all, if that is what truly has been happening.

Maybe voting Red isn't really a bad thing, even if she is a good guy; she's a very useless one.

Well, Red does have five votes against her already, but she might be a role character, or something.

I, for one, think that this "Mara Jade" character is a bunch of junk made by Cinderella. (But not really surprising.)

And all of these scenarios? Isn't that just giving the scum ideas on how to go about things?

I would say it would be wise to cut down with the scenarios. But I guess we can't go back now.

[Flipz]

And all of these scenarios? Isn't that just giving the scum ideas on how to go about things?

I would say it would be wise to cut down with the scenarios. But I guess we can't go back now.

See, this is why I can't trust myself--I go and be all super cautious about the identity of a potential Scum, and then I say/do something stupid like that. :wall: In the future, just kick me in the megablocks--you know I like that, remember, lover?

OK, I need to ask my allies one last time in private, and then I'll get final word out on Mara Jade.

[Dakar A]

See, this is why I can't trust myself--I go and be all super cautious about the identity of a potential Scum, and then I say/do something stupid like that. :wall: In the future, just kick me in the megablocks--you know I like that, remember, lover?

No matter what, the scum will think of one or more of these at one time, examinig the possiblities can help the Townies (and in -the-closet PR's) decide their courses of action.

[Piratedave84]

Well, Red does have five votes against her already, but she might be a role character, or something.

I, for one, think that this "Mara Jade" character is a bunch of junk made by Cinderella. (But not really surprising.)

Charming, please elaborate as to why you think MJ is "a bunch of junk made by Cinderella"?

Do you hold any kind of proof that she made those up?

Would you, or anyone in their right mind, go through the trouble of making all of this up?

I would say it would be wise to cut down with the scenarios. But I guess we can't go back now.

Yes because continuing to do so would put WAAAAAY too much pressure on the scum!

Charming, why are the scenarios and breakdowns too much for you?

Do you find yourself targeted? Is thi unsettling to you?

[Donut]

I, for one, think that this "Mara Jade" character is a bunch of junk made by Cinderella. (But not really surprising.)

That's what I said earlier, and I'll explain more below in reference to Jack.

Charming, please elaborate as to why you think MJ is "a bunch of junk made by Cinderella"?

Do you hold any kind of proof that she made those up?

Would you, or anyone in their right mind, go through the trouble of making all of this up?

Do you have proof that she didn't make it up? I don't see anyone presenting evidence to support or refute the claim. In fact this is the only piece of "evidence" that we're working with right now. What I KNOW for certain is that the scums are very intelligent and well organized. If they were able to coordinate such a surgically precise attack (last night), it wouldn't be a stretch of the imagination if they came up with elaborate charade.

Charming your thoughts?

I would also like to hear from the others who have been absent, particularly Little Red Riding Hood (LRRH).

[Flipz]

OK, I've talked, and waited, and puzzled things out, and I've decided to out Mara Jade.

Goldilocks is Mara Jade.

Here's my conversation with a trusted ally, "Indiana Jones", about Goldilocks (some names have been changed to protect their identities):

Here's the last two posts of my PM chain with Goldilocks:

Goldilocks, I hope you remember that YOU are Mara Jade in my play... Do you have anything to say for yourself, or shall I reveal your identity and post all of the messages you've sent to me and Mr. Bear here and in the group PM?

Yes, I realize that you are accusing me. And I understand that you are feeling betrayed. It's only natural when a friend and/or ally dies, and another gets blocked. Unfortuntately, I targetted Mushu last night, just as you asked. Either he's a Thug or a Townie with or without a night action, there's no way to tell without a Role Cop. I'm not sure who leaked the info last Night; I'm checking all my PMs to make sure I didn't drop any breadcrumbs accidentally that the Scum caught on to, and I would advise you to do the same. Looking at my PMs in another window, it would appear that someone caught on to me and decided to frame me:

Hello. I'm PM-ing some people and getting their list of suspects. Who do you think is a Bad Guy? My list is:

Cinderella

Pinocchio

Puss in Boots

Mushu

Who's on yours?

You do seem eager to get rid of Cindy, don't you? Not sure whether that bides good or ill, but I'm definitely going to keep my eye on both of you. Anyway, I don't have many as of yet, but Puss is definitely on there. Mr. Bear as well, maybe. Still working on it.

He also seemed pretty eager to get rid of you, Pinocchio, Puss, and Mushu, all of whom have been either confirmed or are trusted by me. This would be the perfect cover: Mr. Bear, who I accused, dies, and one of the people I said to him that I was 'keeping an eye on' gets blocked. It could either be a lucky move by the Scum, or maybe Mr. Bear said something too much in one of his PMs. At this point, Charming is the only suspect I have.

I'm not going to say anything, I want your opinion. Do I go forward with my threat or not?

Wow.

That's all just... odd.

If I'm reading that correctly, Goldie is saying that Pinocchio was confirmed by him (but yet, we did not hear any good defense of him by Goldie yesterday) Goldie also trusts puss (but today tries to out him as scum with a flaily accusation). And trusts Mushu (whom we both suspect as being a scummy too). Moreover, he says he blocked Mushu, despite trusting him? Or is he saying he trusts him because he blocked him and nothing changed?

There's nothing heaps suspicious in Charming's list (assuming it's from yesterday).

Everyone was after Pino, Mushu was being odd, as was Puss and you, well, you were being loud which could have been (but isn't) as scummy trick. Charming was right to reserve judgement if he felt like it.

All in all this just seems like another attempt to throw someone else to the mob rather than provide an in depth defense. At least, that's how it seems to me. I can't see he's offered anything concrete that vindicates him. It is possible that he's innocent and did just let things slip, except for that fact that Bond was blocked. No one else knew who the doctor was.

A final possibly, way out there, is that the scum did simply get lucky choosing to block Bond and kill bear, but with everything in yesterday's thread the higher percentage play would have been to straight up kill Bond, especially if they had any hint that one of theirs was not in the fireing line from the vig. Either it would have worked and Bond would be dead, or he was doctored and they would have lost nothing much.

Nah. I don't buy it. He's got to be lying about who he blocked.

That's my take based on the above.

*later*

Just been going over PMs catching up with people.

Midway through voting I reached out to Goldie, since you'd indicated you were inclining to trust her.

No response. Not even a hi.

Not especially suspicious on it's own, but with everything else, it's another coat of laquer on the coffin...

*later*

Looking out the window, I'm guessing it a time-zone thing?

But it seems from Witch's reply that there's still suspicion of you and the thought that this is all an elaborate ruse.

I've turned it over several times in my head.

I just can't see luck working for the scum. It has to be an informant.

The expected scum move would have been to night-kill Bond, not block Bond.

The only reason to block bond would be if someone knew Bond is the doctor.

Goldie could still be the town blocker but simply have deeply mistrusted Bond enough to block him. But that doesn't make much sense.

Maybe in an extremely cruel twist of irony, wolfie was the town blocker, targeted Bond out of mistrust. Then Goldie is also a blocker (but scum), really did target Mushu as requested in order to gain trust (knowing it wouldn't make any difference) and spilled the beans on who was who, saying not to aim at Bear. One of the other (dumb) scums misheard and targeted bear anyway, who duly died.

But that's an even more convoluted scenario than what we think happened.

Gah! This game does my head in.

*later*

Here's what Goldilocks/Mara Jade sent me:

I love your plays. Very entertaining. The reason I said that WR was either a vanilla Townie or a Thug/Goon was because, from what I can see, no Scum and/or Townie night action was blocked. Unless, of course, Mushu is the Investigator, and I accidentally blocked one of our power roles. He also could be the Scum Doctor (Listed by Sandy in Lesson Two under the Scum Power Roles). There isn't any way to tell without a Role Cop. Charming might be an iffy lead, but at least it's a lead. I haven't gotten any PMs except from you, Charming, Robin Williams, and Indiana Jones, and I didn't say anything to those last two. So, either I spilled the beans accidentally to Charming, Mr. Bear, being inexperienced, revealed his and Bond's role to someone else, or you yourself blabbed. If you are in contact with the Investigator/Role Cop, please, don't tell anyone, least of all me, about them. Since you seem to trust me and everyone else so little, that would probably be the best course of action. I would gladly deflect any and all accusations you have against me personally, but it's hard to do that when you don't give me anything but plays to go on for what you're accusing me of. And if you really want to get me gone, fine. So be it. I'll die knowing that, at least for one night, I helped the Town.

How can he say, 'he might be the scum doctor?' from what I see there isn't one. There is a scum role cop, granted. Is that a way of playing 'see, I'm not scum I don't know what roles the scum have'? Despite everyone knowing? Sheesh.

Still it does not explain how Bond, the town doctor, ended up being blocked.

He has admitted he's a blocker.

He has not challenged the assertion that he knows Bond's identity.

Either he gave that specific info away (accidentally or deliberately)

Or he blocked Bond himself.

He needs to admit to one of those two.

One test to try is ask charming to turn over all the PMs he's had with Goldie, and ask Goldie to do the same.

If either resist, it's a bad sign. If both do and they match but there's no transfer of info, Charming is off the hook. Unless the records are doctored to elide the communication...

Which suggests a bussing of charming, which logically then says he's a goon too, if he is scum.

In any case. If there is a flaw in your logic, I can't spot it

*later*

*snip, info about other suspicions*

As for Goldie she hasn't yet explained how/why Bond was blocked, especially if the PM chain from both ends matches and was clear. I can buy the scum aiming to kill Bond, but blocking Bond and killing his target is too lucky to be chance.

*later*

Here's Goldilocks' posts since you went to sleep:

I love your plays. Very entertaining. The reason I said that WR was either a vanilla Townie or a Thug/Goon was because, from what I can see, no Scum and/or Townie night action was blocked. Unless, of course, Mushu is the Investigator, and I accidentally blocked one of our power roles. He also could be the Scum Doctor (Listed by Sandy in Lesson Two under the Scum Power Roles). There isn't any way to tell without a Role Cop. Charming might be an iffy lead, but at least it's a lead. I haven't gotten any PMs except from you, Charming, Robin Williams, and Indiana Jones, and I didn't say anything to those last two. So, either I spilled the beans accidentally to Charming, Mr. Bear, being inexperienced, revealed his and Bond's role to someone else, or you yourself blabbed. If you are in contact with the Investigator/Role Cop, please, don't tell anyone, least of all me, about them. Since you seem to trust me and everyone else so little, that would probably be the best course of action. I would gladly deflect any and all accusations you have against me personally, but it's hard to do that when you don't give me anything but plays to go on for what you're accusing me of. And if you really want to get me gone, fine. So be it. I'll die knowing that, at least for one night, I helped the Town.

If you really think Charming is our leak, then I need to know exactly how much damage was done; I need to see that whole PM chain, every single message. If it backs you up, great, I'll back off, and you can have a new code name so as not to prejudice anyone against you. If not, you WILL be lynched.

That is the entire PM chain. Two messages. Then there's the one with me, you, and Mr. Bear, and then this one, one that I didn't reply to from Indiana Jones, then one that I didn't reply to from Robin Williams. That's it. Apparently I'm not very popular around these parts.

Hmm...understandable, considering [metagame]Cirque du Freak[/metagame]. I apologize for bringing that up, but really it's the whole reason no one trusts you...and then there was last night's fiasco. You seem to be coming down with "CallMePie" syndrome.

All right. For now I'll trust you, until Charming gets back to me. There's still serious problems with your story, but with Charming's scummy behaviour yesterday (and my own malfunctioning scumdar), it could be either one of you. :skeptic:

And here's what I said to Charming:

OK, Goldilocks has made a rather strange argument against you in private, and is claiming that you're more suspicious than Mara Jade, and I'd like to find out if what she said was true. To do so, I want to see your entire PM chain with Goldilocks. Hopefully, if you're innocent like I believe you to be, it will vindicate one or both of you as Good Guys, based on the other information I have.

OK, Goldilocks has made a rather strange argument against you in private, and is claiming that you're more suspicious than Mara Jade, and I'd like to find out if what she said was true. To do so, I want to see your entire PM chain with Goldilocks. Hopefully, if you're innocent like I believe you to be, it will vindicate one or both of you as Good Guys, based on the other information I have.

Sure...

First, I said on April 7th:

Hello. I'm PM-ing some people and getting their list of suspects. Who do you think is a Bad Guy? My list is:

The Big Bad Wolf

Pinocchio

Puss in Boots

Mushu

Who's on yours?

And then Goldie said:

You do seem eager to get rid of Cindy, don't you? Not sure whether that bides good or ill, but I'm definitely going to keep my eye on both of you. Anyway, I don't have many as of yet, but Puss is definitely on there. Mr. Bear as well, maybe. Still working on it.

That's all I've sent Goldie.

OK, she's not lying about that then...thank you. I have to go have some discussions. Depending on what my allies make of Goldie's statement, Goldie's suspicions may have just cleared you. In any event, I trust you about...85% now. (Yes, I'm aware of the uselessness of that figure. )

*snip*

OMG, I totally did not notice the discrepancy between Goldilocks' version of Charming's PM and Charming's version of it until just now. Why would Goldilocks change Wolf's name on Charming's scum suspicion list to mine? I feel so much better about sharing this now.

Anyhow, that's it, I discussed with Jones as to whether or not to share this (and their code name ), but that's pretty much it. If anyone wants to see my PM chain with Goldilocks from the beginning, I can do that when I get back from running errands.

[JackJonespaw]

Charming, please elaborate as to why you think MJ is "a bunch of junk made by Cinderella"?

Do you hold any kind of proof that she made those up?

Would you, or anyone in their right mind, go through the trouble of making all of this up?

As there is no way to prove this, that is why I think that. But, as soon as a crumb of fact is placed, I'm sure I'll change my mind, or at least think harder about this.

I may need to read over Cinderella's "plays" again.

Yes because continuing to do so would put WAAAAAY too much pressure on the scum!

Charming, why are the scenarios and breakdowns too much for you?

Do you find yourself targeted? Is this unsettling to you?

I'm never said that it was too much for me, I just don't want to get stabbed in the middle of the night because of one of these plans! And I'm sure that you and everyone else agrees with me. Or do you want to get killed?

Charming, your thoughts?

Look at what I said above.

[...] [...] [...] [...]

All right, after reviewing the plays, I suppose that there is a crumb, maybe even more than a crumb of truth in it about this "Mara Jade". (I didn't use quotes there because he/she is fake, but because it is a nickname.) But, by reading over them, I think I might have an idea of who some people are...

[Chromeknight]

Well, looks like Cindy's power role is "wall of text"

It looks like there is some information skipped in the summary, but it's likely not directly relevant.

MaraJade/Goldilocks/DarthNihilus has a case to answer, has had one for almost a whole day and has failed to answer it so far.

Voting is open right? Based on all that Cinerella has provided I

vote:Goldilocks(Darth Nihilus)

[Palathadric]

OK, I've talked, and waited, and puzzled things out, and I've decided to out Mara Jade.

Goldilocks is Mara Jade.

Anyhow, that's it, I discussed with Jones as to whether or not to share this (and their code name ), but that's pretty much it. If anyone wants to see my PM chain with Goldilocks from the beginning, I can do that when I get back from running errands.

Wow! So much information at once. I would like to see those PMs from Goldie. She is, quite clearly I'd say, the highest on the suspicion list now, but I think we should be careful. We do not want to go ahead and lynch just anyone like we did yesterday. I still can't understand why Pinocchio didn't put up any defence though.

Also, where the devil is Little Red? She said she confirmed, but then disappeared again.

Cindy, I hope you're not running after that horribly un-charming, Charming!

I thought I had your love! Well, if you'll be cheapening that tramp, believe me, I've got a list of other hot babies awaiting.

[Darth Nihilus]

*snippety snip snip snip*

Thank you for finally bringing the truth out. Now I can finally defend myself in public, instead of to you in private, which is way more pressuring because apparently, you think you're the whole town. Look at the end of that one PM you sent me:

If not, you WILL be lynched.

Might I use one of your favorite phrase in the case against Pinocchio: Freudian slip? Also, the leak. Point one: You set the town against Pinocchio because of an allegiance-claim, which might I add you did not an hour previously, and the main thing: a color change. Not scummy behavior, noooo, a color change in the allegiance claim. Plus, who told Bear in the first place to target BBW? You, in the group PM between me, you, and him. Then, you state that the Doctor was blocked. I'm beginning to think that you don't even know who the Doctor is after all. You're just getting the Power Roles together and killing them off one by one. First the most important, the Vigilante. Then, accuse the Blocker of his death, thus eliminating two of the Power Roles successfully. Anything to answer, Cindyrella?

[Dakar A]

OK, I've talked, and waited, and puzzled things out, and I've decided to out Mara Jade.

Goldilocks is Mara Jade.

Here's my conversation with a trusted ally... snip snip snip

[Chromeknight]

Thank you for finally bringing the truth out. Now I can finally defend myself in public, instead of to you in private, which is way more pressuring because apparently, you think you're the whole town. Look at the end of that one PM you sent me:

Might I use one of your favorite phrase in the case against Pinocchio: Freudian slip? Also, the leak. Point one: You set the town against Pinocchio because of an allegiance-claim, which might I add you did not an hour previously, and the main thing: a color change. Not scummy behavior, noooo, a color change in the allegiance claim. Plus, who told Bear in the first place to target BBW? You, in the group PM between me, you, and him. Then, you state that the Doctor was blocked. I'm beginning to think that you don't even know who the Doctor is after all. You're just getting the Power Roles together and killing them off one by one. First the most important, the Vigilante. Then, accuse the Blocker of his death, thus eliminating two of the Power Roles successfully. Anything to answer, Cindyrella?

Let me break it down for ya toots.

Point 1. Cindy admits mea culpa for the lynch of Pinocchio. see her first post in today's thread. Her guilt is complicated by the lack of defense from pino due to family reasons, and the lack of a clear voice defending pinocchio, even though someone claims to have trusted her completely

Point 2. Cindy admits mea culpa for the vig kill of wolf and lays our her case for suspecting wolf. Which is in part because of wolf's tendency to be untrusting and partly because wolf didn't know how many roles there were despite God having told everyone.

Point 3. Cindy's relationship with the doctor. You know what that relationship is. You know how trust works there, and still you question it? As of part way through this game day, I was shown the pm chains that lay out that relationship. There is no gap, the method of verification works.

Point 4. This verification extends to knowing who the doctor protected. He protected bear. Yet bear is dead. Do you need me to use a crayon to complete the inference there?

Final point. Even you don't believe your own accusation of Cindy's scumminess. If you did you would have laid a vote on her...

[Dakar A]

Sorry about the accidental post, I was going to say that Cindy basically lit my brain on fire. I'll have to read overit 1,2 or 17 more times...

Well, looks like Cindy's power role is "wall of text"

Haha!

Even thogh I trust Cindy, I feel that we should allow this MJ thing to play out before voting.

[Darth Nihilus]

Let me break it down for ya toots.

Point 1. Cindy admits mea culpa for the lynch of Pinocchio. see her first post in today's thread. Her guilt is complicated by the lack of defense from pino due to family reasons, and the lack of a clear voice defending pinocchio, even though someone claims to have trusted her completely

Point 2. Cindy admits mea culpa for the vig kill of wolf and lays our her case for suspecting wolf. Which is in part because of wolf's tendency to be untrusting and partly because wolf didn't know how many roles there were despite God having told everyone.

Point 3. Cindy's relationship with the doctor. You know what that relationship is. You know how trust works there, and still you question it? As of part way through this game day, I was shown the pm chains that lay out that relationship. There is no gap, the method of verification works.

Point 4. This verification extends to knowing who the doctor protected. He protected bear. Yet bear is dead. Do you need me to use a crayon to complete the inference there?

Final point. Even you don't believe your own accusation of Cindy's scumminess. If you did you would have laid a vote on her...

Point one: I never said that! I said, after the Night cycle had ended and we all found out Pinocchio's allegiance, that Pinocchio was on a list of people that had either been confirmed via death or trusted to an extent by me.

Point two: That might have been a logical move on Cindy's part, but still, combined with spearheading the lynch against another Townie, you have to admit she is suspicious.

Point three: Yes, I recognize the connection between her and the Doctor, but whether we believe her or not is based on the factor which is in question here: trust. Do we trust her enough to believe that she really is in contact with the Doctor, but won't reveal their identity to us when she revealed mine? The situation is basically just a matter of who you trust more: her or me. One of us is the leak, and it damn well isn't me. She probably says the same. So, that means that who's getting lynched depends on which of us you, the Town, trust more. Plus, a few different things factor in. Scum will, of course, vote for the Town one of us. Town will probably spread their votes based on trust. So, assuming that one of us is actually Scum, and assuming a 50/50 Town vote spread, the one that gets lynched will be the Town one. Unfortunately, neither of those situations are 100% likely. We could both be Town, or (I'm going to let you decide on this one) we could both be Scum accusing each other to cover our own trails.

Point four: Again, this extends the trust issue. How do we know the Doctor really protected Bear? All we have to go on is Cindy's word. Without a Tracker, there's no way of knowing who the Doctor targetted last night.

Final point: Fine, if you really want me to do the obvious thing and vote for my accuser and/or the one I'm accusing, I'll simply Vote: Cinderella (Flipz). Good enough for you?

[Chromeknight]

Final point: Fine, if you really want me to do the obvious thing and vote for my accuser and/or the one I'm accusing, I'll simply Vote: Cinderella (Flipz). Good enough for you?

There you go. Well done. Turns out Goldilocks has balls after all.

As for trust. Answer this.

There was a discrepancy between the list you quoted from Charming and the list Charming provided.

WHY?

[Darth Nihilus]

There you go. Well done. Turns out Goldilocks has balls after all.

As for trust. Answer this.

There was a discrepancy between the list you quoted from Charming and the list Charming provided.

WHY?

Because he changed the list. Not me; him. I never change phrases in PMs or quotes. If I did, it would be something more obvious, probably more like changing it to "Hey look! I'm scum!" in all caps. Not changing names on a suspect list. That just doesn't make any sense to me. Why change one name? What is there to gain from that? No matter how hard I try, I can't figure out the logic behind that.

[Chromeknight]

Because he changed the list. Not me; him. I never change phrases in PMs or quotes. If I did, it would be something more obvious, probably more like changing it to "Hey look! I'm scum!" in all caps. Not changing names on a suspect list. That just doesn't make any sense to me. Why change one name? What is there to gain from that? No matter how hard I try, I can't figure out the logic behind that.

So, Charming. Balls are in your court, are you up for a game of "she says, he says"?

Did you change the list?

Does someone want to claim that Cindy changed the list to further muddy the waters?

How about bear? Did he vig-kill the list and that's why it's wrong...

But good to know, Goldie, you're bright enough to go for the obvious "hey look, I'm scum" ploy. That'd make you so much more trustworthy...

[Flipz]

Then, you state that the Doctor was blocked. I'm beginning to think that you don't even know who the Doctor is after all. You're just getting the Power Roles together and killing them off one by one. First the most important, the Vigilante. Then, accuse the Blocker of his death, thus eliminating two of the Power Roles successfully. Anything to answer, Cindyrella?

You know damn well who James Bond is, and you know exactly how monumentally stupid it would be for me to lie about that!

Point one: I never said that! I said, after the Night cycle had ended and we all found out Pinocchio's allegiance, that Pinocchio was on a list of people that had either been confirmed via death or trusted to an extent by me.

Point two: That might have been a logical move on Cindy's part, but still, combined with spearheading the lynch against another Townie, you have to admit she is suspicious.

Point three: Yes, I recognize the connection between her and the Doctor, but whether we believe her or not is based on the factor which is in question here: trust. Do we trust her enough to believe that she really is in contact with the Doctor, but won't reveal their identity to us when she revealed mine? The situation is basically just a matter of who you trust more: her or me. One of us is the leak, and it damn well isn't me. She probably says the same. So, that means that who's getting lynched depends on which of us you, the Town, trust more. Plus, a few different things factor in. Scum will, of course, vote for the Town one of us. Town will probably spread their votes based on trust. So, assuming that one of us is actually Scum, and assuming a 50/50 Town vote spread, the one that gets lynched will be the Town one. Unfortunately, neither of those situations are 100% likely. We could both be Town, or (I'm going to let you decide on this one) we could both be Scum accusing each other to cover our own trails.

Point four: Again, this extends the trust issue. How do we know the Doctor really protected Bear? All we have to go on is Cindy's word. Without a Tracker, there's no way of knowing who the Doctor targetted last night.

Final point: Fine, if you really want me to do the obvious thing and vote for my accuser and/or the one I'm accusing, I'll simply Vote: Cinderella (Flipz). Good enough for you?

Point one: OK, my bad, you've got to admit, though, you phrased it poorly. That doesn't explain the fact that you trust one of our top candidates for Scum (Mushu), aside from you of course.

Point two: Yes, I've admitted I screwed up with Pinocchio. You've yelled at me for it. I've yelled at me for it. Everybody's yelled at me for it. Would you like me to perform a play solely about people yelling at me for having a screwed-up scumdar? Because I can totally do that if it makes you feel bette.

Point three: Once again, you know exactly who our Doctor, James Bond is, and you know why my betraying them last night would have been monumentally stupid, especially if I were Scum and you were not. (Actually, you're living--for now --proof that that betrayal was a lousy play for Scum. )

Point four: I don't think I need to explain why this argument is nonsensical, especially considering you were told James Bond's Night Action results by James freakin' Bond himself.

Final point: And in a show of completely contrived cruel irony, I'll mirror your actions (see what I did there? ) and Vote: Goldilocks (Darth Nihilus), for the reasons stated earlier.

Because he changed the list. Not me; him. I never change phrases in PMs or quotes. If I did, it would be something more obvious, probably more like changing it to "Hey look! I'm scum!" in all caps. Not changing names on a suspect list. That just doesn't make any sense to me. Why change one name? What is there to gain from that? No matter how hard I try, I can't figure out the logic behind that.

You're right, I can't figure out what a Scum would stand to gain from changing one name in their quoted suspect list. Why don't you tell us?

Oh, wait, I know why! Ooh, too bad that would expose poor Mr. Bond. Well, that's partly my own fault for not reading carefully enough before posting, but really, nearly getting the Doctor's identity exposed? That's a genius move! (Yes, I am being serious and congratulating a Scum on a well-planned--if unsuccessful--play.) That way, when the Doctor dies tonight, the Scum can claim that everyone already knows who the Doctor is, so just because they knew doesn't make them a suspect. Great play, I'm glad I didn't fall for it.

Actually, coming down off the soapbox for a moment, you really have done quite well for a Scum. I'm just more obsessed with Mafia prepared than you, and you had the misfortune of being the Scum I suspected of having a Power Role and thus extended contact to. Great playing, but...checkmate.

*gets off soapbox* LYNCH THE SCUM!!! BUT TAKE NAUGHTY PHOTOS FIRST!

[LEGOman273]

Cindy is right. It was a good move by the Scum. Too bad it didn't work.

We have more from Goldy than we did from Pino; I'm now convinced that she is Scum. Thus, I:

Vote: Goldilocks (Darth Nihilus)

1138.