Yakuza Family - Day 3

[Peanuts]

Before I change my mind about this: the other blocker was Minoru. The person who vouched for Minoru I trust. But their reasons for trusting Minoru, I'm shaky on. I can't think that there are three blockers here, including Tadau. That leaves Minoru as the scum blocker.

I don't quite understand, what's that with the three blockers?

Anyway, if Minoru claimed blocker, he's likely to be a Mutineer. That should be enough for a lynch.

[CMP]

Oh, this is interesting.

Everyone, chill! My wife ain't a scum simply cos she hasn't said nothin'. Sis, why are you so sure Yasu is a traitor? Maybe you're tryin' to shift the general consensus on my darlin' wife.

Well, I can understand his reluctance to vote for her here.

I'm only defendin' her because she's my wife...

We've got to root them out quickly and efficiently. Float as a butterfly, sting like a bee.

Defending her purely for reasons of roleplaying...bit of a newbie mistake, but...

I think that there be a possibility that Yasu wants to be lynched. Maybe she is a bomb? Or she is actually the Town Role Cop and she went and role-claimed to two people or she is a Mutineer goon and this is all an elaborate plot to take us all down.

My brain was melted by her mind games.

A few hours passes, it looks like she's going down, so he quietly changes his mind.

OK, it seems clear to me that Yasu is the centre of suspicion and I see nothing to change it therefore:

Vote: Yasu (TheBoyWonder)

Well, that's that.

My naive wife, the scum won't give you a chance. The numbers are against you, and they may put one of 'em fancy blockers on you.

This has a bit confused. A scum who's lynched another would probably see them as scum already, wouldn't they? But it does make it sound like he still thinks she has a chance.

Good job, my son. You are learnin' this quickly. The accused is your mother, but remember, in a family like ours, you never know who's out to get you.

Irony.

It sounds to me like a subtle, roleplaying-based defense that nobody challenged simply because he wasn't being taken seriously. I vaguely remember this during day one, but didn't think much of it due to his general inexperience in situations like these. I might've been mistaken, but I still think it's possible the rest of the scum were using this to their advantage and trying to get him to quietly defend her while keeping their own necks out of it.

Kinda makes sense when you consider what's been going on around him.

[MetroiD]

Tadao trusted me enough to actually consult me on who to block before he was brutally murdered last night. And I couldn't even suggest anything plausible to him since I had pretty much no leads what to base that on... Do you know whose fault that is? All of you who seem to trust the most random persons with the most vital info, and then decide not to share it with people who could actually help lead you the right way. Tadao's blood is on Norio's hands, and Ichirou is actually on mine for not having been able to defend my first-born son like I should have.

I'm looking forward to those of you who have been promising to do so to actually step up and come forward with the information you have. We need to share as much as we can about last night if we are to get things going our way again; 3 loyal Yakuzas dead over the course of one night; even if one was actually God's will, is not a nice thing. And honestly - look at all of last night's deaths. Apart from the one that could not have been averted and came as a natural reflection of the Kami's powers, the others seem to have been caused not by the Mutineers, but have come as a direct consequence of our own, misguided decisions. So that's right, it's time you pulled your collective heads out of the gutter and started thinking straight. What happened yesterday was a crying shame, do NOT let that happen again.

I will not be commenting on the subject of Minoru before having some more information to base that on. However, that is not the only person in our Family who needs to be worried right now.

[Brickdoctor]

Thanks for going back and restating those, Shizuko. Saves me the trouble of doing it myself.

It appears that my note was based on the first and fifth statements. Though in the first post, he apparently thinks that I'm "so sure" Yasu is Scum, and I'd never said anything like that. (that was before Yasu had said anything) And he didn't seem to understand why I was accusing Yasu in the first place. I hope I'm not connecting the wrong dots, but that's the same original defense Yasu put up. Perhaps Yasu didn't know what to say and decided to repeat what had been said recently in her defense by a fellow Scum? (I know that first post and Yasu's first post weren't that far apart, because I remember I was annoyed at having to explain the reason I suspected Yasu in two consecutive posts)

[MetroiD]

Anyway, if Minoru claimed blocker, he's likely to be a Mutineer. That should be enough for a lynch.

Sooo let me just get that straight.

The Scum blocker went ahead and actually claimed their role to someone who's presumably not scum (according to Norio), who then in turn went and shared said claim with a third person (Norio), who just happens to also claim that he is not scum. Does that sound just a bit _stupid_ to anyone else?

[CMP]

Sooo let me just get that straight.

The Scum blocker went ahead and actually claimed their role to someone who's presumably not scum (according to Norio), who then in turn went and shared said claim with a third person (Norio), who just happens to also claim that he is not scum. Does that sound just a bit _stupid_ to anyone else?

Um, no, because nobody would claim scum.

[Nightshroud99]

Sooo let me just get that straight.

The Scum blocker went ahead and actually claimed their role to someone who's presumably not scum (according to Norio), who then in turn went and shared said claim with a third person (Norio), who just happens to also claim that he is not scum. Does that sound just a bit _stupid_ to anyone else?

It sounds very stupid Sensei, it seems alot of folks are running with their heads cut off, blurting roles to anyone who will listen.

As for last night...

I am saddened to see three of my fellow Yakuza die, many didn't even get an honorable fight: cut down from behind, or slaughtered by.. chickens. I am happy to say that the chicken is featured in this mornings Tempura Chicken however. As well as my famous Koilette roll, it always seems to cheer me up.

As others have said, it does seem we should look into Ichriou's suspicions of Momoe and Tamiko. If only for information at least.

Now I must go light a candle to honor Ichirou in the Kami. I am sorry my suspicions against you were so harsh; that they bore no fruit.

[MetroiD]

Um, no, because nobody would claim scum.

*Sigh*

Not quite following that nice, big, chunky, eye-popping train of thought I've laid out there, are you. Well, it's not the first time that's happened.

Read again. Please. Then re-read, it's just one sentence anyway. If it doesn't work, keep reading. Until it actually dawns on you that a scum sharing their role with anyone who ISN'T scum, regardless whether directly or indirectly, would be an incredibly stupid, not to mention pointless, move. And no, they don't need to actually claim that they're scum.

Seriously, there's a question I've been trying to ask for the last couple of days here and I think the right formulation of that mantra has almost come to me --- erm, scum or plain mind-numb? (*almost there...*)

[Peanuts]

*Sigh*

Not quite following that nice, big, chunky, eye-popping train of thought I've laid out there, are you. Well, it's not the first time that's happened.

Read again. Please. Then re-read, it's just one sentence anyway. If it doesn't work, keep reading. Until it actually dawns on you that a scum sharing their role with anyone who ISN'T scum, regardless whether directly or indirectly, would be an incredibly stupid, not to mention pointless, move. And no, they don't need to actually claim that they're scum.

Seriously, there's a question I've been trying to ask for the last couple of days here and I think the right formulation of that mantra has almost come to me --- erm, scum or plain mind-numb? (*almost there...*)

So, what exactly are you saying? That Norio-sama is propably scum himself and making up the whole story? That Norio's blocker is Yakuza too? I'm not sure I get what you mean. Could you please elaborate?

[CMP]

Read again. Please. Then re-read, it's just one sentence anyway. If it doesn't work, keep reading. Until it actually dawns on you that a scum sharing their role with anyone who ISN'T scum, regardless whether directly or indirectly, would be an incredibly stupid, not to mention pointless, move. And no, they don't need to actually claim that they're scum.

I disagree. It would be risky, but managing to indirectly claim to one of the town's 'leading members' puts the scum in a very powerful position. I think that if this was their plan, it was screwed up by Takao being so open with his role to Akira. See, if Ichirou hadn't accused Takao on his deathbed, he probably would not have been killed. If that occurred, then there would still be two blockers, the scum of which Norio would still believe is the townie one.

The thing is, with Takao's death, we now have him confirmed as the townie blocker. Which leaves Minoru in a very uncomfortable position.

The point is, gaining the trust of one of the biggest townies first and upfront is a potentially lethal strategy to the townies. If Takao hadn't opened up to Akira, who knows, it may have worked up until the former's lynching.

[Brickdoctor]

Read again. Please. Then re-read, it's just one sentence anyway. If it doesn't work, keep reading. Until it actually dawns on you that a scum sharing their role with anyone who ISN'T scum, regardless whether directly or indirectly, would be an incredibly stupid, not to mention pointless, move. And no, they don't need to actually claim that they're scum.

No, it's not. It's actually probably one of the easiest ways to get into a Townie circle. Very risky, if you claim a role that can be verified through other actions (or if you make a really bad claim, like Nancy the pet Psychiatrist snake) or if you're investigated, (unless you're the Godfather) but it can be done. (I hate to metagame, but in a book called Gotham City Mafia, a Scum character a lot like myself was trusted by the Town for the majority of the game because he claimed Investigator to a Townie in private on Day 2) Blocker, of course, isn't as easy to fake as, say Watcher, Tracker, or Investigator, but claiming it is still not that stupid and not at all pointless.

[MetroiD]

If we have any reason to believe that story, as you obviously do, that reason would have to be substantiated by someone's night actions and the results from those. Let us see how the day progresses and what other information we do receive.

[Cecilie]

I can see we had a bad night. And I'll have to disinfect the place again with all that blood and gore lying around

I'll echo what has already been said, but I can't see how Minoru can be a loyal Yakuza when Tadao is confirmed as the town blocker. I wonder what stopped the Mutineers from being able to perform their kill tonight though. Maybe we should consider that they could have converted someone instead of killing tonight?

[JimBee]

Damn... three loyal Yakuza lost in a single night... though I have to agree with Momoe here... Ichirou's blind attempts at lynching others before himself did not put him in a good light. Though I am disappointed Tadao was Yakuza as well...

And now I hate to play the devil's advocate, but there is a chance that Minoru is loyal. It's a big pond, and if any of you have ever read the ancient scrolls of Eurodine, it is very likely to have duplicate town roles...

[def]

I don't quite understand, what's that with the three blockers?

Anyway, if Minoru claimed blocker, he's likely to be a Mutineer. That should be enough for a lynch.

I'm saying that "three blockers" is the only way I could imagine Minoru not being scum... But no, I'm not proposing that. In fact, I revealed Minoru's identity before I had any second thoughts, or got convinced otherwise. Minoru is the way to go today.

Sooo let me just get that straight.

The Scum blocker went ahead and actually claimed their role to someone who's presumably not scum (according to Norio), who then in turn went and shared said claim with a third person (Norio), who just happens to also claim that he is not scum. Does that sound just a bit _stupid_ to anyone else?

Yeah, your theory sounds more than a bit stupid

What's your honest theory? All three of us are scum? There is only one, and it's me, and I'm scum?

I'm trying to think of how you think everyone should coordinate with you, when all you've done so far is be a windbag. I'm not demanding people work with me, it's just happening.

There is a network of cleared people here. I'm in it. You aren't. Information is flowing between us. Don't be jealous. Minoru had a role-claim to one of the people in that group, but certainly wasn't cleared, and didn't get any real information from me, just friendliness, and an assumption of trust. I rescind that, and look forward to Minoru's explanations. In private, I explained to him that if Tadao was Yakuza, the only option was to give town Minoru's head. I notice that Minoru went quiet here literally within minutes of me revealing them to town, so I assume that is due to last minute consulting with their scum buddies.

As for the flow of information in our group, there are two vanillas there. I'm sharing a little more with the specials of the group, and less with the vanillas. There is a fair chance for recruitment in this situation, so it would be a terrible danger if any vanilla attempted to organize or collect too much information, and were then recruited. I'm using the assumption that specials are unrecruitable. So, any vanillas plowing away, demanding information should be ignored, for the sake of your life, and the security of town.

And now I hate to play the devil's advocate, but there is a chance that Minoru is loyal. It's a big pond, and if any of you have ever read the ancient scrolls of Eurodine, it is very likely to have duplicate town roles...

If we were to hear about a third blocking on day one, perhaps it would be plausible. But scum could claim that to make us think that there were three. Even if they were lying, it would take a day to check Minoru through investigation might be a worthwhile chance for scum to take.

I don't want to base any decision off of Eurodine

I wonder if any of you have noticed a discrepancy in the way Nobuo interprets events. For example:

Scenario A: Nobuo helps railroad our tracker to lynch, taking credit for it yesterday.

Nobuo's interpretation: Sorry, guys. Pobody's nerfect That's why pencils have erasers. Oops. Alright now, everybody send me their night actions so I can organize us!

Scenario B: Norio publicly announces he's working a plan to kill a suspected scum blocker, but they turn up town. The next day, he submits the other candidate.

Nobuo's interpretation: Can't you see! It's a scum plot! You're being fooled! The sky is falling! Etc. etc. until day four comes

It's a curious pattern. I wonder why that is

[MetroiD]

What's your honest theory?

My honest theory, as of this moment, is that we can't say with certainty that Minoru can only be scum, as people have suggested. I've merely stated the obvious; perhaps I've done so in a rather negative manner though, for which I hope the rest of the Family will excuse me. The fact that you think it means I'm assuming you're the guilty party here though does speak for itself -- and to answer your question straight away: no, at no point have I said that you're a Mutineer. I voted against you yesterday in order to "get you going", and because I thought your behaviour was fishy. I will not pursuit the same vote because I believe there are more pressing issues at hand.

And no, I'm not saying everyone should coordinate with me. Looking back on my previous statements, I realize it might sound that way - and honestly, it wouldn't have been a bad idea. If anything, that could have helped minimize the amount of dead Yakuza bodies last night. But the thing about the windbag, coming from your helpful, trustworthy and cool-headed majesty's mouth, is just a bit rich. I don't want to go into the stuff that we've been over for the last two days, so let's just agree to disagree for the time being.

Once again, don't be jumping to conclusions, I'm merely pointing out that we need to cover our bases for once. If anything, we now need as much information as we can lay our hands on - and if behind-the-scenes dealings is the way to obtain that, then so be it. Let's just have a dead Mutineer tomorrow morning, that's all I really want.

As to your brilliant sharp-minded scenarios... allow me to just laugh those off for the time being, since I honestly don't want to be discussing just how derailed your train of thought still seems to be.

[Scubacarrot]

Nobuo, just read your posts back for a minute, you seem quite happy to take credit for some things, and eager to jump to conclusions. I somehow think that might be one of the reasons people are not sharing with you.

On topic: From what I have seen in the past, it is unlikely that there are duplicate roles out there, perhaps slight variations, but not the same. There could be a Jailkeeper out there or something.

[WhiteFang]

Oh dear... This is getting bad.. Ichirou was a part of our Yakuza Family. He was not part of the Mutineers. So, we might have really lost a blocker.

Apart from Yasuko's accidental death, only Tadao was murdered by the very Ninja who wield 2 katanas. I am extremely bothered by this 2 scenes... The outfit for the 2 vigilantes are obviously different and why is there only one killing? It makes me wonder if those killings can only be used on alternate days on either sides? I am making a bold assumption and often enough, I am not sure if pictorial clues might help.

I hope to consolidate my thoughts on this killing issues for discussion, and ultimately in latter days, this might become clearer. I am also quite certain and confident that certain patterns can be established through pictorial aspects.

As you can see in Night 1, that was definitely a Ninja donning his/her Black or Green Ninja grab that had killed our young Lloyd! While, in Night 2, Tako was killed by a Ninja who had donned another Ninja grab design, which could be ranging from white, red or grey. My gut feeling tells me that the Night 1 killing is done by the Mutineers. For some odd reason, this did not happen in Night 2 and it was obviously killed by another different person. I don't have firm grounds why only one killing took place and whether if it's by choice or by the settings of the environment.

One more interesting to note, Llyod's teddy bear is still around and I can't help but to think that there are hints behind these. Maybe I ramble too much but I hope I can at least piece some of the coincidences together.

Night 1 killing done by Black Ninja vigilante (example)

Night 2 killing done by White Ninja vigilante (example)

[iamded]

Three more of us dead in such short a time! Oh, it's a sad sight seeing this family tear itself apart. But we shall seek out and remove these scummy Mutineers! So if there are two blockers, and one has been revealed as Yakuza (Tadao, rest his soul), then the other blocker must be scum. It's the more likely, logical conclusion. Lex parsimoniae, and all that. I suppose there's a chance that there are two Yakuza blockers and no Mutineer blocker, but I don't think we'd be that lucky.

And it's quite likely that the scummy Mutineer blocker role-claimed to a loyal Yakuza to gain their trust, then followed their suggested actions to seal that trust. It's a good plan for a Mutineer to use, as they could launch a surprise strike at a critical moment. At least, it would have been a good plan had both the blockers not role-claimed...

I'll wait for this alleged scum blocker, Minoru to speak up first, though Shizuko's recap of Minoru's defence of Yasu was a rather valid. It's not looking good, Minoru. We await your explanation.

[Capt. Redblade]

Oh dear... This is getting bad.. Ichirou was a part of our Yakuza Family. He was not part of the Mutineers. So, we might have really lost a blocker.

Apart from Yasuko's accidental death, only Tadao was murdered by the very Ninja who wield 2 katanas. I am extremely bothered by this 2 scenes... The outfit for the 2 vigilantes are obviously different and why is there only one killing? It makes me wonder if those killings can only be used on alternate days on either sides? I am making a bold assumption and often enough, I am not sure if pictorial clues might help.

I hope to consolidate my thoughts on this killing issues for discussion, and ultimately in latter days, this might become clearer. I am also quite certain and confident that certain patterns can be established through pictorial aspects.

As you can see in Night 1, that was definitely a Ninja donning his/her Black or Green Ninja grab that had killed our young Lloyd! While, in Night 2, Tako was killed by a Ninja who had donned another Ninja grab design, which could be ranging from white, red or grey. My gut feeling tells me that the Night 1 killing is done by the Mutineers. For some odd reason, this did not happen in Night 2 and it was obviously killed by another different person. I don't have firm grounds why only one killing took place and whether if it's by choice or by the settings of the environment.

It looks to me that besides a Mutineer killer, we also have a SK or an overzealous vigilante on our hands. Hooray, those are always fun.

[WhiteFang]

It looks to me that besides a Mutineer killer, we also have a SK or an overzealous vigilante on our hands. Hooray, those are always fun.

For the time being, I don't tend to think that we have a serialised killer on the loose.

[Brickdoctor]

It looks to me that besides a Mutineer killer, we also have a SK or an overzealous vigilante on our hands. Hooray, those are always fun.

Have you guys been listening?

As I said, I was consulting with the vig, and, as planned, Tadao was taken out. I'm shocked he came up Yakuza. Ichiro, by the end of the day, in private and in public, was seeming town. But Tadao's explanations and behavior was seeming very scummy. I can't express how disappointed I am with that result as I was depending on it.

[WhiteFang]

Have you guys been listening?

I did, and draw conclusions from there and based on the pictorial evidences.

[Brickdoctor]

I did, and draw conclusions from there and based on the pictorial evidences.

That statement was actually mostly directed at Lizzy. She apparently thinks that the kill was the work of an SK or overzealous vig, when, as Norio has already stated, it was a planned vig kill.

[Fred Daniel Yam]

Alright, thank you Norio and everyone for that oustanding ovation.

So he says I'm a Blocker, importantly, a Scum Blocker. He has based his results on the fact that Tadao is the Town Blocker. So far nothing wrong with his reasoning. Then he says that I must be the only way to go today, this means he is 100% convinced that I am a Mutineer. This is what I have to say.

I am the Renegade Yakuza RoleBlocker, I function as a normal RoleBlocker does except I can choose my alignment. I blocked Norio on Night 1 and I am not scum.