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Erebus

Help Save Graphic Novel #10

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Fate undecided...

Okay, I want to be straightforward with you guys. I am here to ask you to please purchase a copy of Graphic Novel #8: Legends of Bara Magna and Graphic Novel #9: The Fall of Atero. Sales of these two books will help determine whether the tentative Graphic Novel #10: Power of the Great Beings will ever see the light of day. Who knows, we might even see Graphic Novel #11...

If 8 and 9 sell well and they do 10, then most likely 11 would be the two 2010 comics plus a few new stories set post-Mata Nui and Makuta. But I have not heard anything from Papercutz in a long while.
Papercutz has expressed some interest in POSSIBLY keeping the GNs going past the end of sets, if sales seem to warrant it. BIONICLE has done very well for them, now they have to see how it does with no toys or toy marketing to support sales.
Again, what I was told is that Papercutz did have an interest in continuing the graphic novels, since they did well for them, but they don't want to plunge into it without knowing they will still sell without LEGO toy marketing support. So if you want more GNs, buy 8 and 9 rather than just coming online to find out what happened in them. They need to see there is an audience for this or there is no point in them continuing to do them.

I asked Papercutz for their input on the matter.

In regards to whether Graphic Novel #10 will be released and if sales was the only factor:

We do not know yet. This will indeed depend on the sales of Graphic Novel #’s 8 and 9, and other internal matters I’m not at liberty to discuss. Sorry! The main thing is sales.

In regards to whether a Graphic Novel #11 can exist:

The possibility still exists, but I have no new information at this time.

There is no guarantee of GN 10 being released, but we can try.

Now, why EXACTLY do we want GN 10 to be released? Well, the GN will have a lot more information on Mata Nui's journey to the Valley of the Maze? We will see the Element Lord of Sand interact with Mata Nui. The Element Lord of Sand in GN 8 was drawn by Stuart Sayger, so in GN 10, we'll see him drawn by another artist, Christian Zanier. Awesome art like the what we see on the cover is expected. And what exactly is the power source that was located in the Great Volcano? We'll learn more about that too.

If you cannot afford to get both books, I suggest you get GN 8 as it has all new content. Both books are relatively cheap (that's my opinion) and absolutely worth getting. Not only does Christian Zanier, the artist for Hydraxon's Tale, come back, but Stuart Sayger, the artist for the 2006-2007 BIONICLE comics, returns as well for GN 8.

GN 8 features three all new comics:

  • Fall and Rise of the Skrall, detailing the Skrall's first encounter with the Baterra
  • The Exile's Tale, featuring Malum's exile from Vulcanus
  • All Our Sins Remembered, featuring the Core War and the Shattering

You can use these links to pre-order/buy GN 8:

Amazon

Barnes & Noble

GN 9 supposedly features the 2009 Glatorian comics:

  • Sands of Bara Magna
  • The Fall of Atero
  • A Hero Reborn
  • Before the Storm
  • Valley of Fear

You can use these links to pre-order/buy GN 9:

Amazon

Barnes & Noble

On another note, because of this situation, BS01 will not be adding GN 8 spoilers until further notice. If BIONICLE cannot survive through sets, then the story must go on. It's really up to the fans to keep BIONICLE alive, and what better way to do that than to do buy these books?

As a "thank you" for reading what I have to say, I would like to show you an exclusive GN 8 image someone provided me with. Just to let you know, you MAY NOT spread this image to BZPower as their spoiler policy strictly says that you cannot do so at this time. Anyways, here is the image.

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Edited by Erebus

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Ahhh..A baterra by Stuart Sayger, I always loved his style. so dark. so fitting. those beautiful shades that begin rough and ends softly.

I wonder if I can get these books on argentina..

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I wan already going to buy GN8, but seeing this picture of the Battera just made me want it much more now.

In fact, its even encouraged me to start buying graphic novels if I had the money.

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I'll definitely buy GN#8. It'll probably have to wait until I'm back up at college in a week, but there's no way I'm missing out on the first graphic novel to have exclusively new, unreleased comics. And I hope enough people agree to make GN#10 a reality!

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As I said before, I'll be picking up GN #8 for sure, since it's made entirely up of exclusive content. I'm not so sure about #9 though, as I already have all the comics that appeared in it. But hey, who knows. :wink:

On another note, that Baterra is absolute win. Not exactly how I pictured it, as it was inferred that they would look something like the Bohrok, but still incredibly awesome. :thumbup:

Edit:

Ugh, the element lords look absolutely terrible. The EL of water has a bubble for a head, the El of Jungle looks like the Swamp Thing, and I can't even figure out what the other two are supposed to be. Great going Sayger, you just ruined what could have been some of the coolest characters ever in Bionicle. :sadnew:

Edited by Grevious

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I really dislike that the Element Lords image was released. *sighs*

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As I said before, I'll be picking up GN #8 for sure, since it's made entirely up of exclusive content. I'm not so sure about #9 though, as I already have all the comics that appeared in it. But hey, who knows. :wink:

On another note, that Baterra is absolute win. Not exactly how I pictured it, as it was inferred that they would look something like the Bohrok, but still incredibly awesome. :thumbup:

Edit:

Ugh, the element lords look absolutely terrible. The EL of water has a bubble for a head, the El of Jungle looks like the Swamp Thing, and I can't even figure out what the other two are supposed to be. Great going Sayger, you just ruined what could have been some of the coolest characters ever in Bionicle. :sadnew:

IMO, the Element Lords are practically impossible to depict anyway, given how they've been described. Your whining convinced me to actually check out the video, and from what I see they look brilliant-- far better than what I thought possible even in sets. Sayger more than did them justice.

Of course, leave it to BIONICLE fans to find pleasure in hateful griping. Part of the reason I haven't been on BZPower in a long time. Hate to pull the "I'd like to see you do better" card, but fact is I have never seen a better depiction of the Element Lords, and I'd love to see any drawing by you or anyone else that can put me in my place.

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Eh, sometimes you can't help these things, Erebus. You can't keep everyone from posting spoilers. :|

Regardless, I'll still buy both graphic novels. Even if scans weren't released, reading it online or looking at pictures doesn't come close to actually owning it and having it in your hands.

Thanks for the image of the Baterra though. :)

-Mesonak

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Eh, sometimes you can't help these things, Erebus. You can't keep everyone from posting spoilers. :|

Regardless, I'll still buy both graphic novels. Even if scans weren't released, reading it online or looking at pictures doesn't come close to actually owning it and having it in your hands.

Thanks for the image of the Baterra though. :)

-Mesonak

Oh, I agree. Actually, this whole thing is my fault. I know where those images came from and it was due to a request of mine.

I am glad you're still buying the novels. I agree with that sentiment.

No problem. :)

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Haha. I saw 3D Brickthing bump this on the news. Cheater. :tongue:

Anyways, I might buy #8. It all depends on how good it is.

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Oh, yeah, I would like to add one more thing. We saw the Baterra drawn by Stuart Sayger for the Core War story. The Baterra is supposed to show up in the Skrall story too. Christian Zanier draws for the Skrall story, so we will get two interpretations of the Baterra.

Also, if you did not like Sayger's interpretation of the Element Lords in GN8, buy GN8 and/or GN9 so we can get Zanier's interpretation of the Element Lords (Element Lord of Sand) in GN10. :P

Edited by Erebus

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IMO, the Element Lords are practically impossible to depict anyway, given how they've been described. Your whining convinced me to actually check out the video, and from what I see they look brilliant-- far better than what I thought possible even in sets. Sayger more than did them justice.

Of course, leave it to BIONICLE fans to find pleasure in hateful griping. Part of the reason I haven't been on BZPower in a long time. Hate to pull the "I'd like to see you do better" card, but fact is I have never seen a better depiction of the Element Lords, and I'd love to see any drawing by you or anyone else that can put me in my place.

To be honest, I probably could do better than that, as could many of the other artists on BZP. It confounds me how people continue to praise Sayger's artwork as revolutionary when, for the most part IMO, it's just plain lazy. All of the element lords look like they were drawn in about a minute each, and they look more like primative monsters than the powerful, inteligent beings we witnessed in the serials. The Element Lord of Jungle in particular doesn't look inteligent in the least - in fact, he doesn't really even look plantlike! What I (and likely many othrers) would have wanted to see what how Greg had described him - a warrior that was covered in vine-like armor, which could also possibly be actual plants. Sayger's monstronsity just looks like a big clump of goop with teeth - like something Makuta Chirox would have created on a bad day.

I think my biggest problem is that thes beings just don't look like any of the other Great Being's creations - they have none of the elegance and grace of The MU robot or the ruthless elegance of the Baterra. They're just generic monsters, and not well-drawn ones at that. Call it whining if you like, but I don't think I'm obligated to praise what I consider bad art. I would have much rather have had Zanier done the entire graphic novel, as I know he would have done a fantastic job.

Oh well, at least the baterra look cool. :sceptic:

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Oh, I agree. Actually, this whole thing is my fault. I know where those images came from and it was due to a request of mine.

I am glad you're still buying the novels. I agree with that sentiment.

No problem. :)

Actually Erebus, I think you should not feel bad at all, as your request was a good idea.

Phantoka Kopaka Nuva, who just informed me that some people don't have access to the GN, can now see what he battera and EL look like.

I can buy graphic novels and I plan to get them even after seeing the battera. But I chose not to look at the EL to keep myself interested in buying it. Technically, it would be better to see scans and not use money to purchase them, but really, its completely different to have it actually in your own hands and to see all the great artwork by Stuart Sayger and Christian Zanier.

My opinion does not mean much, however, for me I remember being interested since 2001 and it is one of my biggest hobbies, if I can, why not keep it alive as long as possible?

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IMO, the Element Lords are practically impossible to depict anyway, given how they've been described. Your whining convinced me to actually check out the video, and from what I see they look brilliant-- far better than what I thought possible even in sets. Sayger more than did them justice.

Of course, leave it to BIONICLE fans to find pleasure in hateful griping. Part of the reason I haven't been on BZPower in a long time. Hate to pull the "I'd like to see you do better" card, but fact is I have never seen a better depiction of the Element Lords, and I'd love to see any drawing by you or anyone else that can put me in my place.

Antrozek's sand creatures come to mind, although they aren't specifically ELs or made out of Bionicle parts.

Haha. I saw 3D Brickthing bump this on the news. Cheater. :tongue:

I posted the story and then I think the ToRII announcement was pinned, then unpinned again, so I think it was just the board re-bumping it. :look:

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I like the elemental lords a lot, they all look very cool, yes, even the Jungle one. I especially like the sand, water, and fire ones.

The Battera are nice too.

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To be honest, I probably could do better than that, as could many of the other artists on BZP. It confounds me how people continue to praise Sayger's artwork as revolutionary when, for the most part IMO, it's just plain lazy. All of the element lords look like they were drawn in about a minute each, and they look more like primative monsters than the powerful, inteligent beings we witnessed in the serials. The Element Lord of Jungle in particular doesn't look inteligent in the least - in fact, he doesn't really even look plantlike! What I (and likely many othrers) would have wanted to see what how Greg had described him - a warrior that was covered in vine-like armor, which could also possibly be actual plants. Sayger's monstronsity just looks like a big clump of goop with teeth - like something Makuta Chirox would have created on a bad day.

I think my biggest problem is that thes beings just don't look like any of the other Great Being's creations - they have none of the elegance and grace of The MU robot or the ruthless elegance of the Baterra. They're just generic monsters, and not well-drawn ones at that. Call it whining if you like, but I don't think I'm obligated to praise what I consider bad art. I would have much rather have had Zanier done the entire graphic novel, as I know he would have done a fantastic job.

Oh well, at least the baterra look cool. :sceptic:

Not all warriors have to be sleek, graceful athletes. The way the EL of Jungle is drawn makes me think of a samurai, with an intimidating suit of armor and helmet-- except this armor and helmet is drawn from nature. Besides, the story heavily emphasized that it was unclear whether he was just wearing plantlike armor, or whether he was actually made of plants (the same applies for all of the element lords, in fact). And I think he looks plenty plantlike, what with the leaves and branches sticking off of him.

Remember that the GBs did not just "create" the Element Lords-- they brought them into being by modifying the Glatorian/warrior species and making them one with their elemental powers. And these give me just that impression-- somewhat crude fusions, which makes perfect sense given how much earlier the creation of the Element Lords were than some of the MU things. Remember, also, that the GBs were themselves responsible for creating Tren Krom-- one of the most atrocious beings in BIONICLE.

Meanwhile, I'm no worshipper of Sayger, either. I think he did terribly with the Toa Mahri and many of the Toa Inika. Some of the Skrall pictures from the graphic novel, which were leaked early on, had vicious-looking blades that seem more appropriate for a fantasy video game like Warcraft than for the blunt, plastic BIONICLE universe. But I'm at least willing to give him credit when he does hit the target. The dynamic and fluid shading of these shows more than a minute of work, and to be honest is a great deal of detail for what looks to be a fairly small panel. Sayger has talent-- he's not the best BIONICLE comic artist by any stretch, but you insult his work by trivializing the amount of effort that went into it. People all too often do that, casually insulting creative work that goes into BIONICLE and ignoring that real people put hard work into set design, comic art, writing, and all the stuff that makes BIONICLE what it is.

I look forward to seeing your own interpretation of the element lords. As it is, I'm perfectly happy with Sayger's designs so far.

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I dunno, Anch, I think 2006-Sayger was the best Bionicle comic art we've ever gotten, which is why I'm excited for the 8th graphic novel.

2007-Sayger, however, was pretty sloppy.

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I dunno, Anch, I think 2006-Sayger was the best Bionicle comic art we've ever gotten, which is why I'm excited for the 8th graphic novel.

2007-Sayger, however, was pretty sloppy.

For some characters he was sloppy (mainly the Toa Mahri, Turaga Vakama, the background Matoran in the finale, and the Mask of Life). I think he did a good job with the Barraki and the Zyglak, as well as our good friends Maxilos, Spinax, Hydraxon, and Gadunka. And in 2006 he did OK, but Jaller Inika always looked like he had some sort of beak, and again most of the background Matoran were perplexing. Really his talent seemed to be with villains, or any other characters who are meant to be very intimidating (like Axonn).

And of course, as always, I have to emphasize that we can't give Sayger all the credit-- as with any artist, the colorists do a great job in giving life to his drawings.

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Not all warriors have to be sleek, graceful athletes. The way the EL of Jungle is drawn makes me think of a samurai, with an intimidating suit of armor and helmet-- except this armor and helmet is drawn from nature. Besides, the story heavily emphasized that it was unclear whether he was just wearing plantlike armor, or whether he was actually made of plants (the same applies for all of the element lords, in fact). And I think he looks plenty plantlike, what with the leaves and branches sticking off of him.

Remember that the GBs did not just "create" the Element Lords-- they brought them into being by modifying the Glatorian/warrior species and making them one with their elemental powers. And these give me just that impression-- somewhat crude fusions, which makes perfect sense given how much earlier the creation of the Element Lords were than some of the MU things. Remember, also, that the GBs were themselves responsible for creating Tren Krom-- one of the most atrocious beings in BIONICLE.

Meanwhile, I'm no worshipper of Sayger, either. I think he did terribly with the Toa Mahri and many of the Toa Inika. Some of the Skrall pictures from the graphic novel, which were leaked early on, had vicious-looking blades that seem more appropriate for a fantasy video game like Warcraft than for the blunt, plastic BIONICLE universe. But I'm at least willing to give him credit when he does hit the target. The dynamic and fluid shading of these shows more than a minute of work, and to be honest is a great deal of detail for what looks to be a fairly small panel. Sayger has talent-- he's not the best BIONICLE comic artist by any stretch, but you insult his work by trivializing the amount of effort that went into it. People all too often do that, casually insulting creative work that goes into BIONICLE and ignoring that real people put hard work into set design, comic art, writing, and all the stuff that makes BIONICLE what it is.

I look forward to seeing your own interpretation of the element lords. As it is, I'm perfectly happy with Sayger's designs so far.

I'm not going to argue about this anymore, but I can say that you're blowing this out of proportion, Aanchir. All I said was that I thought his interpretation of the Element Lords was terrible and rushed, and that I don't particularly like his artwork. Is there anything wrong with expressing my opinion? It's not proven fact that "yes, this interpretation is awesome," it's only your opinion, and my opinion just happens to be different. It's not like I insulted you personally or something - and even you admitted that he has rushed things before.

Honestly, I really don't see what the big deal is. People have complained about all aspects of Bionicle on this site for years, while for the most part I've been fairly positive. Now I come out and say that one minor part of Bionicle is terrible, and it's like I've insulted Sayger's dying grandmother or something. Isn't that a bit unfair?

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I am gonna try to get these novels even though I haven't got any before. I should say this is a worthy cause.

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I'm not going to argue about this anymore, but I can say that you're blowing this out of proportion, Aanchir. All I said was that I thought his interpretation of the Element Lords was terrible and rushed, and that I don't particularly like his artwork. Is there anything wrong with expressing my opinion? It's not proven fact that "yes, this interpretation is awesome," it's only your opinion, and my opinion just happens to be different. It's not like I insulted you personally or something - and even you admitted that he has rushed things before.

Honestly, I really don't see what the big deal is. People have complained about all aspects of Bionicle on this site for years, while for the most part I've been fairly positive. Now I come out and say that one minor part of Bionicle is terrible, and it's like I've insulted Sayger's dying grandmother or something. Isn't that a bit unfair?

As an aspiring artist, I can't help taking offense when someone trivializes the hard work of another artist or designer. So to say you don't like the Element Lords is fine, but saying that the art is "lazy" or that each EL looks like they were drawn in about a minute each is going too far. I'm not asking you to change your opinion, or even to acknowledge my own, but those sorts of accusations are terrible and demeaning.

Fact is, the quality of his work varies, and is subject to interpretation. But like any professional artist he is obligated to put thought and hard work into what he does. It's the same as when people talk about a BIONICLE set and say it "could have been designed by a five-year old"-- to do so utterly rejects the hard work and the years of experience the set designers put into it.

If you're an artist yourself you should understand how cutting such insults are. If someone said to you that you were lazy and something you put hard work into could have been done in a minute, it would be more than a difference of opinion-- it would be slanderous. There's a difference between criticism and insensitive flaming. And just because you don't know Sayger personally and aren't talking to him directly doesn't make those sorts of statements permissible.

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Mmm, I requested for the video to be removed, but the uploader was being rather ignorant:

"Well Mr."Topic Closed" I don't think I will. Well I do want to see GN10 but....BIONICLE is actually ending and the story is.....Very good but I'm getting tired of it and the late new chapters from one of the story serials on BIONICLEstory.com. I do understand you BZP denizens want to see that GN but...I don't think I will remove the video. Also I got those pictures from Brickshelf. I hope you understand the situation. And the Element Lords would look the same as they do in "All our sins remembered" so I'm not interested.Sorry but my final answer is no."

Anyways, hopefully these images won't discourage people from buying the book(s).

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For some characters he was sloppy (mainly the Toa Mahri, Turaga Vakama, the background Matoran in the finale, and the Mask of Life). I think he did a good job with the Barraki and the Zyglak, as well as our good friends Maxilos, Spinax, Hydraxon, and Gadunka. And in 2006 he did OK, but Jaller Inika always looked like he had some sort of beak, and again most of the background Matoran were perplexing. Really his talent seemed to be with villains, or any other characters who are meant to be very intimidating (like Axonn).

And of course, as always, I have to emphasize that we can't give Sayger all the credit-- as with any artist, the colorists do a great job in giving life to his drawings.

I liked a lot of his funky background matoran, they were neat and very unique.

As an aspiring artist, I can't help taking offense when someone trivializes the hard work of another artist or designer. So to say you don't like the Element Lords is fine, but saying that the art is "lazy" or that each EL looks like they were drawn in about a minute each is going too far. I'm not asking you to change your opinion, or even to acknowledge my own, but those sorts of accusations are terrible and demeaning.

Fact is, the quality of his work varies, and is subject to interpretation. But like any professional artist he is obligated to put thought and hard work into what he does. It's the same as when people talk about a BIONICLE set and say it "could have been designed by a five-year old"-- to do so utterly rejects the hard work and the years of experience the set designers put into it.

If you're an artist yourself you should understand how cutting such insults are. If someone said to you that you were lazy and something you put hard work into could have been done in a minute, it would be more than a difference of opinion-- it would be slanderous. There's a difference between criticism and insensitive flaming. And just because you don't know Sayger personally and aren't talking to him directly doesn't make those sorts of statements permissible.

As an aspiring artist myself, I think you're blowing this waaaaay out of proportion, man.

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