Technic Color Palette

[Jim]

There has been quite some discussion about the new color schemes and color palettes. This topic is to discuss these new colors....we have been asking for for years 

[MangaNOID]

comment unworthy 

Edited June 7, 2017 by MangaNOID

[Theo van Vroenhoven]

47 minutes ago, Jim said:

There has been quite some discussion about the new color schemes and color palettes. This topic is to discuss these new colors....we have been asking for for years 

Is there a comprehensive overview available of all 'technic colors' including coverage of parts? Rebrickable may be?

[Jim]

5 minutes ago, Theo van Vroenhoven said:

Is there a comprehensive overview available of all 'technic colors' including coverage of parts? Rebrickable may be?

Interesting question. Rebrickable obviously will be able to generate such a report. Not sure if it's readily available. I can ask Nathan.

Before we do that, I think we need to define which parts (or categories) we need in order to build a colored Technic MOC.

• Panels (complete range)
• Liftarms (complete range, 2L - 15L)
• Flexible axles (different lengths)
• Angled connectors (#2 - #6) 
• Perpendicular connectors (2L and 3L)
• Axle Connector 2L (Smooth with x Hole + Orientation)
• Pin Connector Round 2L with Slot (Pin Joiner Round)

Since I am not much of a MOC-er I might have missed some parts, but these are the essential parts in a certain color for making a good looking colored Technic MOC. 

[1gor]

Just one thing - I've noticed that some light bluish gray 16 tooth gears reinforced (within 8110 set) and some dark bluish gray differentials have different shades, so I have one question @Jim - does this discussion include gears or just group of parts that you have organized in list above?

Thanks 

[Jeroen Ottens]

6 minutes ago, Jim said:

Interesting question. Rebrickable obviously will be able to generate such a report. Not sure if it's readily available. I can ask Nathan.

Before we do that, I think we need to define which parts (or categories) we need in order to build a colored Technic MOC.

• Panels (complete range)
• Liftarms (complete range, 2L - 15L)
• Flexible axles (different lengths)
• Angled connectors (#2 - #6) 
• Perpendicular connectors (2L and 3L)
• Axle Connector 2L (Smooth with x Hole + Orientation)
• Pin Connector Round 2L with Slot (Pin Joiner Round)

Since I am not much of a MOC-er I might have missed some parts, but these are the essential parts in a certain color for making a good looking colored Technic MOC. 

I'd say that is a pretty complete list (and even in order of priority if you would ask me). The only ones I would add is angled connector #1 and the axle-axle connector (#1 with axle holes only).

And the half-width liftarms

[Ivan_M]

49 minutes ago, Jim said:

• Flexible axles (different lengths)

 

The complete range of 7-11-12-14-16 and 19 is available in red and black only, that is why I avaoid them. They are scarce and expensive. Luckily they are only cosmetic and easily replacable with custom pneumatic hose.

I think panels are the biggest issue, new cool panels are released in weird colors and some basic colors appeared once or twice in past ~7 years (like yellow #5 in 3 sets in 2010 and 2011). Lego used to release suplemenary packs of usefull parts (like styling pack 5220), it would be cool to see them again.

[nerdsforprez]

Agree with the above.  I also think it is one thing to discuss available color palette, but another to discuss the breadth of the color palette in available colors.  Before an expansion of colors occurs I would like to see a broader range of pieces available in certain colors.  Example, lime green technic pieces obviously exist; but only in limits elements.  For a MOCer, this makes modifying or MOCing in different colors difficult.  

Also, fans have been asking for years to adjust the availability of certain, frequently used pieces in more uniform colors.  Example: Blue 3L pins.  They used to exist in black, but not really any more.  For adult builders, this can be important b/c the odd blue color is off-putting for models built in other colors.  It would be nice if these pins were available in other colors to blend in better in builds.   

[1gor]

Just now, nerdsforprez said:

Agree with the above.  I also think it is one thing to discuss available color palette, but another to discuss the breadth of the color palette in available colors.  Before an expansion of colors occurs I would like to see a broader range of pieces available in certain colors.  Example, lime green technic pieces obviously exist; but only in limits elements.  For a MOCer, this makes modifying or MOCing in different colors difficult.  

Also, fans have been asking for years to adjust the availability of certain, frequently used pieces in more uniform colors.  Example: Blue 3L pins.  They used to exist in black, but not really any more.  For adult builders, this can be important b/c the odd blue color is off-putting for models built in other colors.  It would be nice if these pins were available in other colors to blend in better in builds.   

That is correct, so lots of our projects remain unfinished because we want to make good models for existing vehicles or other stuff that we use as inspirations... Talking about "42070 color", we got panels that are (mostly) exclusive to Technic, but liftarms can be used in other LEGO Themes.

What is very positive is that wheel racing medium 56 X 34 is available in light bluish gray, black, red and yellow so we have variety of new possibilities (now we only need lime green )

https://www.bricklink.com/v2/catalog/catalogitem.page?P=15038#T=C

 

[Erik Leppen]

The problem is not the colors, The problem is that every color has only few parts. I love my bright green, but with only 5,  7 and 11 beams, 2 connectors and a few panels, it's hard to do much with it. 

I really don't get why 42070 would be in dark azure, rather than medium azure used in 42050 and 42059. That would be equally cool for kids, but expanded that nice new color's parts range into usable quantity and variety. Now we're put up with two half-assed palettes. Why do designers do this? I'm sure they know that the range of parts in a color has to be varied enough to build anything at all.

To give a good example: for me, the white cargo plane 42025 was the set for white. Before that, white was rare. After that, white was widely available, mostly due to that set. Get that one set, and you can build thousands of things in white. It has many beams, connectors and panels in white. The Porsche (together with two smaller orange sets) seem to do the same thing for orange, but unfortunately the Porsche's licence made it too expensive to buy as a parts pack.

To give a bad example: the ocean explorer is a dark blue set of 1000 parts. As much as 24 are dark blue: 19 panels and 5 beams. How would one build anything else than a ship from those panels? The only dark blue set that had actually interesting parts in that color, was the limited edition crawler 41999, which costs a fortune nowadays so it doesn't count. And that's what I don't understand: if you look at the actual amount of colored parts in that set, it's as if they add as few as possible of the color on purpose.

• The ocean explorer 42064 has 24 dark blue out of 1300+, which is 2%.
• The funny car 42050 has 18 medum azure out of 600+, which is 3%.
• The go kart 42048 has 10 orange pieces and 4 purple, out of 350 parts, which is about 4%.
• The stunt truck 42059 has 12 medium azure out of 200, which is 6%.
• The jet 42066 has 54 medium blue out of 1100+ which is about 5%.
• The motorcycle 42063 has 27 blue out of 600, which is 3,5%.

By comparison, the mine loader 42049 has 79 yellow out of about 600, which is 12%. Also, the ocean explorer has 93 red pieces (7%) and 128 white (10%). Apparently, when the color is ubiquitous they don't mind, but for a color that is rare, they seem to rather keep it that way. That's what I can't stand, even though I really love all those cool colors. It seems deliberate.

 

[Jim]

2 hours ago, Jeroen Ottens said:

I'd say that is a pretty complete list (and even in order of priority if you would ask me). The only ones I would add is angled connector #1 and the axle-axle connector (#1 with axle holes only).

And the half-width liftarms

#1 connector....how could I forget. Of course, you are right.

Half width liftarms.....would be nice, not necessary (imho).

[Immo]

I still dream of a truly modern Lego, where the company releases sets as they are now, but also produces parts in all the colours from the pallet, available for purchase. That would make our lives easier, folks wouldn't be buying bootlegs like Dec**l, Xi**ao, Le*in etc. to get more or less matching parts in desired colours. But I guess the ecological and economical impact will be too big...

[kbalage]

1 minute ago, Immo said:

I still dream of a truly modern Lego, where the company releases sets as they are now, but also produces parts in all the colours from the pallet, available for purchase. That would make our lives easier, folks wouldn't be buying bootlegs like Dec**l, Xi**ao, Le*in etc. to get more or less matching parts in desired colours. But I guess the ecological and economical impact will be too big...

Well that would be amazing for sure.. As I buy my parts from Bricklink mostly I'm not familiar with the actual situation - the parts available from Lego via Pick a Brick, are they limited to the current lineup of sets and the colors available there, or can you actually buy "old" parts or colors not currently available in any set?

[Immo]

Just now, kbalage said:

Well that would be amazing for sure.. As I buy my parts from Bricklink mostly I'm not familiar with the actual situation - the parts available from Lego via Pick a Brick, are they limited to the current lineup of sets and the colors available there, or can you actually buy "old" parts or colors not currently available in any set?

I never used Pick a Brick, but I reckon they only seel parts from the sets as they produce parts for sets mostly. You'll never get a panel that's not in a colour used in one of the released sets. Same goes with the "old" colours like " Stone" shades of Grey (replaced with "Bluish" shades of Grey), I guess.

You'd probably be able to get a panel that was used once in, let's say, 2009 set. I did a quick look at PaB and it looked pretty limited, though. Maybe because they detected I'm Polish?  We seem to have many limits on us everywhere.
 

[mocbuild101]

1 hour ago, Erik Leppen said:

The problem is not the colors, The problem is that every color has only few parts.

Agreed, which is why I build mostly with black - almost all Technic parts have been made in black, including tires. 

[Jim]

Rest assured. TLG is well aware of our predicament, so they will be releasing more sets in the current colors. Maybe we simply need to be patient, something which can be hard for us AFOLs.

[Jeroen Ottens]

2 hours ago, Erik Leppen said:

The problem is not the colors, The problem is that every color has only few parts. I love my bright green, but with only 5,  7 and 11 beams, 2 connectors and a few panels, it's hard to do much with it. 

I really don't get why 42070 would be in dark azure, rather than medium azure used in 42050 and 42059. That would be equally cool for kids, but expanded that nice new color's parts range into usable quantity and variety. Now we're put up with two half-assed palettes. Why do designers do this? I'm sure they know that the range of parts in a color has to be varied enough to build anything at all.

To give a good example: for me, the white cargo plane 42025 was the set for white. Before that, white was rare. After that, white was widely available, mostly due to that set. Get that one set, and you can build thousands of things in white. It has many beams, connectors and panels in white. The Porsche (together with two smaller orange sets) seem to do the same thing for orange, but unfortunately the Porsche's licence made it too expensive to buy as a parts pack.

To give a bad example: the ocean explorer is a dark blue set of 1000 parts. As much as 24 are dark blue: 19 panels and 5 beams. How would one build anything else than a ship from those panels? The only dark blue set that had actually interesting parts in that color, was the limited edition crawler 41999, which costs a fortune nowadays so it doesn't count. And that's what I don't understand: if you look at the actual amount of colored parts in that set, it's as if they add as few as possible of the color on purpose.

• The ocean explorer 42064 has 24 dark blue out of 1300+, which is 2%.
• The funny car 42050 has 18 medum azure out of 600+, which is 3%.
• The go kart 42048 has 10 orange pieces and 4 purple, out of 350 parts, which is about 4%.
• The stunt truck 42059 has 12 medium azure out of 200, which is 6%.
• The jet 42066 has 54 medium blue out of 1100+ which is about 5%.
• The motorcycle 42063 has 27 blue out of 600, which is 3,5%.

By comparison, the mine loader 42049 has 79 yellow out of about 600, which is 12%. Also, the ocean explorer has 93 red pieces (7%) and 128 white (10%). Apparently, when the color is ubiquitous they don't mind, but for a color that is rare, they seem to rather keep it that way. That's what I can't stand, even though I really love all those cool colors. It seems deliberate.

 

It is on purpose. Introducing an existing part in a new colour is more expensive than using an existing part in an existing colour.

Furthermore the number of different parts in a model is also minimized, so this adds to the limited selection of parts in a new colour.

When I worked at TLG roughly half of the design time was used to make the model, the other half of the time was used to get all these 'secondary' requirements in place.

[Jim]

Exactly. Same goes for stickered parts. TLG simply cannot sticker every part, because a stickered part becomes a new element. If they do print every part, they will have to build a new warehouse for parts which are only used in a single set.

[kbalage]

14 minutes ago, Jeroen Ottens said:

It is on purpose. Introducing an existing part in a new colour is more expensive than using an existing part in an existing colour.

This is exactly why it does not seem to be logical to have this many shades of blue for the Technic lineup. What could be the benefit for Lego to produce parts in multiple shades instead of using 2 or 3 only? It would be beneficial for them as well to limit the variation as there would be for sure more shared parts with the previous sets (-> lower cost), and also welcome by the community to have a wider selection of parts of one color.

[Jim]

12 minutes ago, kbalage said:

This is exactly why it does not seem to be logical to have this many shades of blue for the Technic lineup. 

That is definitely a valid point. Maybe they chose blue and medium azure, but they didn't like medium azure after all (or children didn't), so they switched to dark azure. That's something we haven't asked.

[Immo]

1 hour ago, Jim said:

Maybe we simply need to be patient, something which can be hard for us AFOLs.

Thanks, Jim, you made my fear of incoming 30th birthday even bigger! Being elderly is around the corner!

[AkiyamaWataru]

Just now, Immo said:

Thanks, Jim, you made my fear of incoming 30th birthday even bigger! Being elderly is around the corner!

It's harder as it sounds. I know what I'm talking about, as I had my 30th birthday on the 18th off may. 

[jotta93]

@Erik Leppen It seems that TLG does that on purpose as a business strategy. They release a few different parts of a new colour in different sets so that we have to buy more sets and spend more money in order to have a proper collection of a single colour. It's more profitable to them than if they released a single set with a bunch of parts in a new colour.

It sucks but I kind of get it

[Jeroen Ottens]

2 hours ago, Jim said:

Rest assured. TLG is well aware of our predicament, so they will be releasing more sets in the current colors. Maybe we simply need to be patient, something which can be hard for us AFOLs.

That is good to hear. But if you look at the 2017 lineup it is a bit of a mixed bag:

The 42070 is adding a new colour instead of extending the medium azure palette

The 42069 is expanding the purple palette, but TBH of all palettes that need extension purple is not even in my top 10
The 42068 is not expanding the red palette at all (unless they have a hidden smooth toggle joint or a #3 connector in there )

For the rest of the 2017 line up dark blue is expanded the most I think and a few white elements were added (togglejoint, 2L beam with axlehole (but that actually is not in a Technicset)) and the 9L orange beam returned

Which also points to another problem. Not only do need a good selection of parts be available, but also they should be used over the years regularly. Red connector #3, yellow curved panel 3x11, white axle-axle connector. These were all available at some point, but went out of use for a couple of years and now they are getting rare and expensive... With more colours available the risk that certain parts in certain colours become rare is increasing...

1 minute ago, jotta93 said:

@Erik Leppen It seems that TLG does that on purpose as a business strategy. They release a few different parts of a new colour in different sets so that we have to buy more sets and spend more money in order to have a proper collection of a single colour. It's more profitable to them than if they released a single set with a bunch of parts in a new colour.

It sucks but I kind of get it

I don't think so. Their primary aim is kids, not collectors. It really is just economics. Technic is a relatively small section for LEGO (I think), so costs of introducing new parts/colours are relatively high. Look for example at the colourvariations you get in SW sets (which have a much higher salesvolume). There the new coloured parts are purely introduced for aesthetic reasons (maybe even enforced by Disney).

[Aventador2004]

1 hour ago, Immo said:

Thanks, Jim, you made my fear of incoming 30th birthday even bigger! Being elderly is around the corner!

Enjoy! 

Just now, Jeroen Ottens said:

The 42069 is expanding the purple palette, but TBH of all palettes that need extension purple is not even in my top 10

The 42068 is not expanding the red palette at all (unless they have a hidden smooth toggle joint or a #3 connector in there )

For the rest of the 2017 line up dark blue is expanded the most I think and a few white elements were added (togglejoint, 2L beam with axlehole (but that actually is not in a Technicset)) and the 9L orange beam returned

Which also points to another problem. Not only do need a good selection of parts be available, but also they should be used over the years regularly. Red connector #3, yellow curved panel 3x11, white axle-axle connector. These were all available at some point, but went out of use for a couple of years and now they are getting rare and expensive... With more colours available the risk that certain parts in certain colours become rare is increasing...

 I actually like the purple, it really pops! But that is my opinion.

When you worked for lego, did you try to keep parts in the mix? Or did you try to mix in new colors?

I think it is good lego is adding more colors, but no more yellow! I missed out on a lot of sets with yellow because I was into system cars at the time.

And they need to add old pieces back in for unhappy AFOLs. Please lego! So many rants would not be out there!