Recommended Posts

Just a personal opinion, but an Aston Martin in orange makes baby Jesus cry. Too flashy colour for a classy car. I'd keep it white even if the Porsche panel would work at the rear.

Aston Martin Vanquish in orange looks supercool for me. Just look at this photo: http://cdn.johnywheels.com/2016/04/08/astonmartinvanquishorange-l-18937ada9e34f574.jpg This car in this color is, in my opinion, the most beautiful coupe in the world.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jeroen you asked for further features. Well here is one which i miss in the forthcoming Porsche: 4 wheel steering but in a smart way:

at low-speed, the rear wheels steers in the opposite direction to that of the front wheels

at high-speed, the rear wheels steers in the same direction to that of the front wheels

What so you think? This would be unique in a supercar because old 8880 has only the former variant

I have thought about that :classic: , but the DB11 has no rear wheel steering, so I won't incorporate that.

The way I would do it though is by combining the steering-mode switcher of the Claes tractor in combination with a rack that slides forward with each step of the sequential gearbox. That way first gear would give counter steering wheels, half gear gives forward steering only and highest gear would give parallel steering wheels.

Today I have worked on implementing my 8D+N+R gearbox (in LDD), but it looks like that will eat up all the space near the rearwheels if I have to use the lego wheel connectors to attach the wheels. So there is no space left for the diskbrakes there either :cry_sad: ...

Edited by Jeroen Ottens

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The way I would do it though is by combining the steering-mode switcher of the Claes tractor in combination with a rack that slides forward with each step of the sequential gearbox. That way first gear would give counter steering wheels, half gear gives forward steering only and highest gear would give parallel steering wheels.

That's a very good idea, I'm not sure how much space it would take, but the concept is elegant. I love mechanical alternatives to stuff that's handled by computers, solenoids and hydraulics. :thumbup:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Aston Martin Vanquish in orange looks supercool for me. Just look at this photo: http://cdn.johnywhee...ada9e34f574.jpg This car in this color is, in my opinion, the most beautiful coupe in the world.

Glad you like it, but if this was an attempt to convince me. Don't bother, I can think of at least 5 colours I like more for an Aston Martin than orange.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Glad you like it, but if this was an attempt to convince me. Don't bother, I can think of at least 5 colours I like more for an Aston Martin than orange.

Sure thing, I was just expressing my own opinion :)

I have thought about that :classic: , but the DB11 has no rear wheel steering, so I won't incorporate that.

The way I would do it though is by combining the steering-mode switcher of the Claes tractor in combination with a rack that slides forward with each step of the sequential gearbox. That way first gear would give counter steering wheels, half gear gives forward steering only and highest gear would give parallel steering wheels.

Today I have worked on implementing my 8D+N+R gearbox (in LDD), but it looks like that will eat up all the space near the rearwheels if I have to use the lego wheel connectors to attach the wheels. So there is no space left for the diskbrakes there either :cry_sad: ...

How big is your gearbox in studs?

I'm curious about possible motorisation. You shift gears by moving lever forward and backward, right? Combining it with gear rack and clutch gear with PF motor would do the job?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sure thing, I was just expressing my own opinion :)

How big is your gearbox in studs?

I'm curious about possible motorisation. You shift gears by moving lever forward and backward, right? Combining it with gear rack and clutch gear with PF motor would do the job?

The current incarnation (version 4 so far) is L*W*H 15*17*6 studs, and that includes the diff and part of the rear suspension.

Motorization shouldn't be too difficult. I did something similar with my Alpha Romeo 4C. This gearbox works with the same quarterturn steps, so either a servomotor or a geared down M-motor will do the job. The driving performance will be horrible though. There are ~20 gears in this version, so the friction will kill all the torque from the driving motor.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is the style I like, the cabin it seems to me a little big but I know it is just the begining.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,

Time for another update. The past week I have been busy in LDD to see if I could fit the 8 speed gearbox in the space behind the rear seats. This is the first attempt that sort of fits. The rear seats might be a bit high though. For now I opt for white as the interior colour and orange as exterior (sorry Appie :blush:), but if the new fender pieces don't fit in the rear I might reverse the scheme.

Things that are not OK still:

- Gears at the back need proper bracing

- One of the switches needs a springmechanism to lock it to either left or right

- One of the switches needs some bracing to prevent it falling out at the underside

- The suspension setup is a simple double wishbone instead of a multilink

A view from the front:

The long axle is for the gear switching mechanism and this will lead to the flappy paddles at the steering column (this is a left driving setup. It is an English car after all :grin: ).

The axles to the motor are hidden inside the central column.

26912544362_738fde24e3_c.jpg

A view from the back:

Here you can see a few of the 20-something gears needed in this gearbox. Friction might become a real issue, but at least all the internal gears are properly braced. But as you can see some gears at the back are not braced at all yet.

26733028970_ea7766f7c9_c.jpg

I hope you like it and as always comments and questions are appreciated.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Question, have you actually built this gearbox to make sure that it will work without issues? That is a lot of gears.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As for the gearbox casing: To avoid friction I would adhere to at least two of my many rules :wink: : 1) each rotating axle should be supported by at least 2 - preferably not adjacent - pin holes, and 2) the casing construction should be completely self-supporting and not rely on any of the rotating axles.

Edited by Didumos69

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nice progress. I don't know if there are a lot of gears. Guys, just look at Sheepo's Veyron and Porsche. They have similiarly complex gearbox and added PF. Just brace it well and it will be awesome model!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not to criticize, but I have little faith in gearboxes designed entirely in LDD and not in real life. How are you going to know if there isn't too much friction on some gear?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not to criticize, but I have little faith in gearboxes designed entirely in LDD and not in real life. How are you going to know if there isn't too much friction on some gear?

I know (and I do share your concern) but I first wanted to have an idea on how to assemble it in such a tight spot. Now that I have figured that out I will build it in IRL and see how it performs. The gearratios are not outrageous, from the top of my head it shifts from 1:1 to 4:25, which is not much more than a standard 6 speed gearbox.

Question, have you actually built this gearbox to make sure that it will work without issues? That is a lot of gears.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,

I have built the gearbox IRL and it works surprisingly smooth. Of course I had to adjust the real model a bit (there were some impossible constructions in the LDD file), but the main gearbox mechanism is just the same and works like a peach.

The gearbox has two outputs that will be combined in the dashboard where the D/N/R selector is located. One output is for the R, that will always rotate at the same speed independent of the selected gear. The other one is for the D and that one will change it's speed dependent on the gear selected. I made a short video to show it in action. I only filmed the 1st and 8th gear, but the others are working as well (I felt it would be a bit repetitive to show them all :sceptic: ).

The selector mechanism is not working yet, there is way too much friction in the driving ring connector, so I need the frictionless variants of the Porsche. Furthermore the changeover catches are not properly fixed yet. I think I will redesign this part a couple of times before I have it reliable enough for my taste, but for a first attempt I am really happy :laugh:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not to criticize, but I have little faith in gearboxes designed entirely in LDD and not in real life. How are you going to know if there isn't too much friction on some gear?

The selector mechanism is not working yet, there is way too much friction in the driving ring connector, so I need the

*COUGH COUGH*toldyouso*COUGH*

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow, this thing is really jam packed with features. Rear mounted gearbox with 8-speeds and paddle shift!? very daunting but you seem to have it all figured out *oh2*

So are you ditching the brake system for the porsche wheels?

*COUGH COUGH*toldyouso*COUGH*

Not really, he meant that the driving rings take too much force to switch because of the connector.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am really really interested in the design (and location) of that gearbox.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,

Another update. I worked most of the time on the central column, which is not very exciting, but took me a lot of time to hide all those axles & gears that needed to be hidden.

I also modified the gearbox slightly (I'll upload some cutaway pictures in the future PvdB) to make more room for the rearseat. In order to get a feel for the space around the gearbox I modeled some bodywork as well. It looks like I could still move the gearbox further to the back without sticking out of the rear. I think I can use the new fender panels of the Porsche in the rear (so sorry Appie, it will be a bright orange car now)... The interior will be either be white/black or white/azure (I got a dark azure steeringwheel from some Chima set I guess).

I fear that white/azure is too flashy for this car. OTOH orange is already quite flashy anyway...

The doors are a bit of a headache. On this side I have 2 large panels behind each other. The advantage is that I get that nice slope at the bottom of the door.The disadvantage is that the door is not a smooth surface and I will get some issue at the top of the door...

Alternatively I can use the Porsche doordesign, which has a smooth surface, but lacks the slope...

What do you think?

27053586260_d847685efa_b.jpg

Edited by Jeroen Ottens

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

(so sorry Appie, it will be a bright orange car now)...

Lol don't worry about me, as long as you like the colour, all is good. I can look past it and marvel and the technique behind it.

The doors are a bit of a headache. On this side I have 2 large panels behind each other. The advantage is that I get that nice slope at the bottom of the door.The disadvantage is that the door is not a smooth surface and I will get some issue at the top of the door...

Alternatively I can use the Porsche doordesign, which has a smooth surface, but lacks the slope...

What do you think?

While it provides that nice gap at the bottom I feel it throws off the rest of the door. In your OP you have an image of the orange one, which looks like there is more going on the side of the door, but on this image from the aston martin site in another colour I can't find that and it looks smooth.

overlooking.jpg

The majority of the door looks silky smooth with the sideskirt being tucked in (for lack of better wording I hope you know what I mean, in dutch: naar binnen loopt). Considering the line of that runs just above the line where the door opens at the bottom, maybe you can figure something out with a panel that goes inward compared to the panel of the door above, which could then be (most of) the Porsche door.

Edited by Appie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,

After the truly disappointing gearbox design of the Porsche I thought I could maybe cheer you up (or rub more salt in the 42056's wounds) by showing you how my 8 speed (+ neutral and only 1 (!) reverse), flappy paddle operated gearbox works. I have tested it now thoroughly in all gears and no geargrinding, no stalling, just smoothly turning wheels, gears & pistons... :devil: .

Still, since I do not have the new smooth connectors inside the driving rings I cannot test the actual switching (and no Paul, I will not sacrifice my precious few new driving rings by breaking out the pins :wink: ). However, unlike the Porsche's version I do have some elastic elements in the design that will ensure that the levers are always at the 90 degree position and thus no unwanted double engaged drivingrings can occur.

So let's start with a picture of the entire geartrain:

26794185454_44c86897b8_b.jpg

On the left is the 8 speed gearbox. You can see three axles coming out of that. The two grey ones are for the motor and the black one is for the paddleshift mechanism.

The grey ones go both to the switch in the center of the assy. The upper grey one is directly coupled to the wheels (ratio 1:1 from the diff), this will power the R of the central selector. So no matter what the actual gearratio is, the reverse will always have the same ratio.

The lower grey axle is connected to the output of the gearbox. The output of the middle gearbox is then brought to the fakeengine.

In the next picture the gearbox is shown from the underside:

26794185474_27dd2ed98f_b.jpg

The gearbox consists of two main parts. On the left there is a 'standard' 4 speed gearbox driving by the red and blue lever that are 90 degrees out of phase. The gear-ratios for this part are 1:1, 1:0.8, 1:0.6, and 1:0.48. Apart from the ratios this is no different from the Porsch design (but in a completely different layout). The knobwheels are used to rotate the axle with the red and blue lever, that consequently will switch the driving wheel.

The output of this part of the gearbox is then transfered to the input of the single drivingring on the right. This driving ring has only two positions with ratios 1:1 and 1:0.333. When the knobwheels are turned 90 degree three times, the left gearbox will have moved from 1st gear to 4th gear. By turning it another 90 degrees this gearbox will jump back to 1st gear. But at this moment the green lever will push the rightmost knobwheel 90 degrees as well, thereby engaging the right driving ring from one end to the other end. (It is not very clear from this picture, but the yellow lever that actuates the green driving ring is actually a combination of two 2L liftarms in a perpendicular arrangment. This way a 90 degree rotation results in a 2L movement instead of the standard 1L movement that a single 2L liftarm would give.) The yellow lever has an elastic band connected to it, so that it will always be pulled in either of it's two positions.

Because the first gearbox was the input of the second gearbox you now get the following outputs extra: 1:0.333, 1:0.267, 1:0.2 and 1:0.16. I you try to turn one more time the mechanism will block itself, because the yellow lever can not rotate further (the same is true if you try to switch from 1st gear to a lower gear).

The gearbox is quite compact, so if anybody feels the urge to replace the Porsche gearbox with a more authentic one (albeit with one gear too many) feel free to adept this design to do so. I hope my explanation made any sense, but if not, please do not hesitate to ask.

Edited by Jeroen Ottens

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It looks pretty complicated. I hope there will be no gear grinding like in the Porsche and it will work flawlessly in real life :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It looks pretty complicated. I hope there will be no gear grinding like in the Porsche and it will work flawlessly in real life :)

I already tested it in real life and there are no issues with grinding nor stalling... Of course I still have to ensure that the levers are all always at 90 degrees, but I solved that problem already multiple times in my previous MOC's so I'm quite confident that I'll solve that on this one as well :classic:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I can't wait to see a video of the gearbox running through gears 1 to 8 and reverse.

If I'm not mistaken this setup with 2 serial gearboxes - even though it will eventually be operated by one set of paddles - could be regarded as a binary gearbox, or is that not correct?

Edited by Didumos69

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I hope Lego is taking notes Jeroen. Seriously, that's a beautiful engineered gearbox.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.